Hey out there ...by chance does anyone know how many babies "were" in Flower's last litter and if they were males or females? Also, how old is Liz then if shes not one from the last litter.

Come on people....anyone????? I just read somewhere that Flower didn't kill the snake. Then I read in Wickipedia about the rest of the season but it doesn't really say what happened to the babies, just that RocketDog is the new DM and is stressed out

I want to know that too meerkatmadness1!
they only showed Liz at the end.

I guess that's gonna be a deep, dark mystery for a long time. I don't even think the KMP knows about Flower's last litter and Liz. Notice that on KMP's 2007 list of all the kats in the study, when you look at the Whiskers' part, you will see 7 pups with 3 different birthdates for each pup? Why? Because the researchers don't know which litter each pup belongs to. As for Liz, I have no idea what her KMP name is/was. So I expect this to be an unsolved mystery for a long time, if not forever

Guys, sorry, but Flower's last litter was the Izzy Sugs and Busta. There was no litter after the precious 3 of them.

Bella and Liz were the two pups mentioned in Flower's last litter. They are the one's being babysat by Spud and Sophie when the cobra entered the burrow. These two are the pups Flower died to save.

Yes and were one of the pups coming above ground after flower died at the end.
If they make a series 4, I hope those pups are mentioned a lot more with more of the group.

Hmm, in the book (spoiler) it mentions Flower aborting after she is bitten by the snake.

It also mentions a litter born in december after the Suggs litter with 2 pups.

Yo

Flower's last living pup is Busta.

The unamed litter born in Dec were the pups MM called Len and Squiggey.

Flower was pregnant when she died.

Liz/Bella represents one of her grandchildren and therefore represents Flower's legacy.

Pronker

Flower was pregnant when she died! Oh my GOODNESS! I'm so sad. The saddness I'v had for Flower was finally slowing moving on, but now this news opens new wounds. Is this in the book?

You know, as sad as that is- and it just is heartbreaking- it is good to know another piece of this mystery. I don't believe it was intentionally not brought out, but I think that maybe at the time of flower's death being made 'public' it would have been just too much to bear for a lot of people. It is still hard to deal with now.
I'm sad, but at least, thanks to athenaxvii we know that the KMP did do everything they could to save her and her family. That knowledge alone makes it just a little better. No less sad, but at least somewhat comforted.

hi pronker,

on the episode when flower dies, why did they show her pregnant, then the next day they stated she had her pups the night before??

thanks

Yo eldn54

I have no idea you'd have to ask the writers/editors of MM why they chose that storyline.

Time lines seem to be different on the manor, they are condensed to show us more in a short time frame.

Pronker

Really? I thought for certain that Flower had a last litter. No wait, wasen't it the reason she died!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
She went down after the snake to save her latest litter, at least I think so.

Not sure why they felt they had to create that story line.

Hi sunshine-1,

My guess: The truth about Flower's death was so horrific that the MM producers tried to put a positive spin on the rest of the story, coming up with a condensed storyline that included true events showing Flower's playful and compassionate sides as well as her bravery and leadership skills. The events just didn't happen on the timeline portrayed in MM.

Judging from the reaction on these message boards (including me), many/most MM fans took comfort in the image of our brave Flower rushing into the burrow to save her newborn pups from the snake. As I recall, that footage could not have been taken at that time because pregnant Flower suddenly looked slim. How else to explain this other than that she had just given birth? The truth of the miscarried litter would have made Flower's tragic death even more unbearable.

IMO, they blew it with the preceding shot of *a snake entering *a burrow (details unknown), because people assumed that a camera crew watched this happen and did nothing. I don't believe this is true. From insider accounts within KMP, I believe the KMP and camera people had no idea anything was wrong until Flower emerged from the burrow the next day, already fatally ill from the snakebite. (Poor baby.)

Finally, showing "Liz" (whoever he/she may be) emerge at the end of JE was a reminder that Flower's legacy lives on. Which is certainly TRUE.

Just my 2 cents. Best wishes to all!

you have to realize every episode is a 2-5 week period. if they just showed you one day in the life of a meerkat group it would be a very boring show. do the math. there are about a dozen shows a season and they film for 8 months. for hardcore fans like us, they didn't really need to remind us how great flower was before they showed her demise, but for someone that was channel surfing (and maybe a future hardcore fan) it was nice to show her addopting axel and defending her newborn litter (even though it didn't happen quite that way). i am usually outspokenly critical about the way the producers often change or rearrange the events. but in the case of the queen of the kalahari, i'm willing to make an exception.

all I can add is thank god for the thread titled Back from KMP..!!!!!! If you have not read it yet, DO SO! It gives alot of insight on how the way flower was taken cared of when she was bitten, and very interesting tidbits on the type of snake that bite her according to the wound she sustained and how it looked. The women went there as part of a volunteer program and just back back a couple of weeks ago. She was very gracious to anwser LOTS of questions on different topics. It really relieved my heavy heart concerning flower. Thought this would help people understand a little better how filming works within the show meerkat manor.

Flower had her babies...but the researchers don't know how many are hers...I know this for a fact because after reading about a meerkat named squigs (born same time as the other 6 pups) being in with the Aztecs, I got confused thinking they were discussing Squiggy who was left behind... So I emailed Evi from KMP site and she told me that squigs is a new pup (which we now know) but they don't who the mother is because THREE females delivered around the same time...Since Rocket Dog lost her litter before the only three that were pregnant was Maybelline, Daisy and Flower...so she did deliver...but the three litters equaled 7 total pups...I don't see any reason why Evi would lie about that...she goes out on the field (kalahari) all the time and works with the meerksta all the time..

Very sorry, but reality is very different. Flower miscaaried her last litter because of the snake bite. There were no pups when Flower was bitten. Her daughters had their pups after Flower's death

So you're saying Evi, who is a researcher and is out there on the field is lying?..What would be her reason to lie about this?...Plus think about it, if she miscarried on 1-25-07 the why do they list that birthday next to the reminding pups...Next to the 7 pups' names they list three birthdays...01-25-07/01-29-07/02-01-07...They did that because they won't sure which pups were born to which female since they were all born in the same burrow closely together...now think about it, if Flower miscarried in a different borrow on 01-25-07 they that would tell them none of the pups were hers (thus not being born on 01-25-07), so they would have just listed the 01-29-07/02-01-07 birthdays...

I think 4 pups.

Yo ratti

Excuse me but no one is lying to you.

Evi has not yet seen the episode and doesn't know how the facts are skewed.

Flower aborted her pups after she was bitten by the snake. They were not living pups and did not survive so they were not named.

However 4 Whiskers females gave birth to 8 pups in the days following the loss of their matriarch, Flower.

Liz probably represents one of her grand daughters who were born after she died and are therefore her legacy to the family.

Pronker

how did four females give birth when only three were pregnant?....Rocket Dog lost her litter...I am really confused..I am trying to find out the real stories because this is something I want to do after completing my vet tech courses...

According to a post I read here, the TCB book says 8 (!!!) Whiskers females (including Flower) were pregnant around the time of her death. WOW.

P.S. It doesn't take long after you start hanging out on these forums to realize that the Meerkat Manor storyline is a highly edited, compressed and sometimes fictionalized portrayal of reality. So be prepared to have your "MM blinders" ripped off, especially in the Spoilers forum (my favorite.) Best Wishes!

Maybe we need a Spoiler's FAQs with sunshine, ccatz, youssy and pronker providing the Answers or anyone who has the "facts".

I know that the show doesn't show the whole truth at times and sometimes doesn't show any of the truth at all (changing names and such)...I belong to 3 other meerkat manor boards, and these changes are discussed there as well, which is why I started email Evi (I just hope she isn't getting annoyed with all my emails and questions)...I sent her another asking about this just a few minutes ago, plus some other questions that I forgot to add in my previous emails...I am still waiting for her to answer two more previous emails (I believe she should be coming back from the field soon)...she replied to my first two email on 09-27-07...and then went back on the field shortly after that (I don't know how it works, how long they stay on the field at a time, or how long they stay home between visits)...I wish Animal Planet wouldn't be allowed to change names and such...You know if they made this an hour long program they fit more of the truth in there and the fans would still watch it (i know i would)....

Yo ratti

I suggest you purchase the book Meerkat Manor: Flower of the Kalahari by Tim Clutton-Brock when you get a chance. It will answer a lot of your questions, also check out the Friends of the Kalahari Meerkat Project website for real time info.

Don't worry you'll see the patterns