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Originally posted by ppatten:

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Originally posted by buckeyegal:
I have often purchased shoes at garage sales and consignment/thrift stores over the years so obviously I do not feel it to be a "nasty" practice. You can find good quality shoes that have never been worn or are in like new condition that have not "conformed" to anyone's feet. They can be wiped out with an antibacterial spray as someone mentioned earlier so I don't see why that is considered nasty, but to each his own. I can't imagine Michelle would buy anything other than gently used or perhaps never worn shoes so I guess I just don't see a problem with it. There are a number of things about this family that I certainly don't agree with and I would not want to live my life as they do, however, buying used clothing/shoes does not trouble me in the least. Now, no sheets on the beds?

I'm not for sure with regard to thrift stores, but I wouldn't think they would carry "never worn" shoes. But perhaps someone bought a pair, wore them a couple of times and they just weren't comfortable or the right size and took them to the thrift store. Which wouldn't be so gross, but shoes that have been worn alot by someone would be a little iffy, to me.

Then again, what do you wear when you go bowling? Shoes that a whole lot of people have worn!

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Originally posted by mom9900:

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Originally posted by cyndeecamden:
[quote by chengdu]Yes, I think all good fathers give their daughter three pennies for mopping the floor.

Three cents per chore. . . I wonder how the girls feel after they clean a bathroom and then receive three cents for their work. I'm sure they feel full of pride and happiness, and that they can't wait to go out to spend their money!

I would rather get nothing than the lousy 3 cents per chore.

Now that JB has the TLC money coming in he could also buy his children new clothes once in a while. And a few sets of sheets and some nightwear for the kids. You know, normal things most parents buy for their children. I am wondering if they buy used underwear for the children?

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Originally posted by mamaof8:
"I would rather get nothing than the lousy 3 cents per chore. "


I think some of you have not understood their system. It is not just the chores that are on the check off list, it is everything they are supposed to do in a day, things they have to do anyways. The check off list is a way for the parents to see what the kids have done/need to do and for the kids to remember and be accountable for their responsibilities.

It was mentioned in a show that in a perfect month they would earn something like $25. All those little checks add up. I have thier book and we follow a very simular system. My kids have about 20 boxes a day, brush teeth( on there 2X), comb hair, put pjs away, practice piano, practice their other instrument, make bed, one meal chore(on the list 3x), pick up thier zone(2x), school work, etc etc etc. The weekly bigger cleaning jobs are worth a bit more.

I have taught my children that they are not paid for thier chores and are certainly not paid for personal hygiene, LOL! They are paid for doing what they are to do, on time and remembering to check it off so I can look in one place and see that the things were done. If they forget to check it off, too bad, no going back and checking off yesterday. Also, if they dilly dally and dont get something done at the right time(like breakfast cleanup before school) then they still have to do it after school, but don't get to check it off.

The money isn't much, since we have a tight budget, but is a bit of a motivation and I have taught them that by small and simple things great things come to pass.

They have been encouraged by the way the money adds up quickly and they get a bit of spending money. But again, the money is secondary. They live in this house, mess it up and therefore clean it up, regardless of money. Im going to make them do thier jobs, so they know if they just do them on time and well, they get a little bonus of a check and some money at the end of the week.

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Originally posted by cyndeecamden:
I would rather get nothing than the lousy 3 cents per chore.

Now that JB has the TLC money coming in he could also buy his children new clothes once in a while. And a few sets of sheets and some nightwear for the kids. You know, normal things most parents buy for their children. I am wondering if they buy used underwear for the children?

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Originally posted by Vera10:
My only question is...if you reward children for doing what they should be doing anyway (cleaning room, helping with dishes, etc.)then what have you really taught them? How does this translate to the real world where you don't get an external reward for keeping your house tidy?
My parents never rewarded us for doing our chores and I am not rewarding my boys. I would much rather they learn to do these things because of the internal sense of pride/satisfaction, not because they get a check or some money for it.

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Originally posted by mamaof8:

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Originally posted by Vera10:
My only question is...if you reward children for doing what they should be doing anyway (cleaning room, helping with dishes, etc.)then what have you really taught them? How does this translate to the real world where you don't get an external reward for keeping your house tidy?
My parents never rewarded us for doing our chores and I am not rewarding my boys. I would much rather they learn to do these things because of the internal sense of pride/satisfaction, not because they get a check or some money for it.

I do understand this point of view and we held it ourselves for quite some time. We only paid for extra jobs. But we wanted our kids to have some more money of thier own and they were asking for an allowance. We feel like the risk of gaining a sense of entitlement from just being handed money just for being alive, in the form of an allowance, was more risky to thier future lives then learning the rewards of dilligence and hard work. While adults dont get paid for cleaning thier house, they also don't get money handed to them at regular intervals just for breathing. Also, my kids aren't adults and we are using the opportunities available to them at this time to teach things for the future. They will be paid based on thier ability to work hard, and do what needs to be done even if it is unpleasant. At this time, we are using household responibilites to foster learning work ethic.

Also, as I mentioned, it is not just chores. The chart is called the Accountability Chart and has everthing on it. No one, least of all a 12 year old boy is going to do dinner dishes for 8 people for 3 cents. He is not really being "paid" to do the dishes. If given the option he would pick not doing them if it only involved 3 cents. But there are consequences in place for having not done dishes, and a reward for doing them on time and cheerfully.

I think that an internal sense of accomplishment is something that takes a lot of time to grow. To me it is like learning an instument. Until you can play well, practicing is very tediuos and not rewarding. Its okay to have "carrots" to encourage getting past that point and then the enjoyment of playing well will come after the hard work. But they are children and helping them past the learning curve is okay. (both with chores/responsibilites and music practice)

Im not sure if this makes any sense or not, but at this time it is what is working for our family.

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Originally posted by cyndeecamden:
[quote by momtombh]Cyndee, I thought I was the only one that felt that way about the sheets and pajamas. I cannot stand to see anyone especially children sleeping on mattresses with no sheets and pillows with no pillow cases. That is just unsanitary to me.

I have no problem with buying consignment clothes. But I stop at the underwear and socks. I wouldn't even buy my kids used shoes not so much of the hygiene factor but because wearing shoes that does not conform to your foot can cause orthopedic problems in the future.

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Originally posted by 1989kb:
I dont understand the rationale behind not having sheets on the bed, but I will add some info regarding the fans that have been seen in the boys rooms. (small black fans that were seen recently on a couple of the beds.)

I read on another board that although TLC did step in and help some with the final finish outs on the house, the Duggars still did not have AC for the first year they lived there. The intent was to wait until they had saved enough money to put it in and pay for it all at once. While I assume this has been done now since they've lived there a few years, perhaps there is just poor air circulation in the room.
We built a new home 7 years ago and it is a two story. We had been living in an older two story prior to that and the upstairs was always hot so we wanted to make sure our new home had plenty of vents and we installed two large units to be sure and accomodate our house. However, prior to moving in we had insulation sprayed in our attic. Not the soft kind, but some kind that dries and sticks to surfaces. THey spayed this sruff on all the ducts in the attic. In the process they covered up the handles which allow you to regulate the air flow. It turns out a couple of these ducts were set to have very low air flow but we didn't realize this at the time. Two of our upstairs room now are either too hot or too cold depending upon the weather. We've tried each year to determine where the valve is so we could fix the problem but unless we are willing to completely strip off all the insulation to find it, we're kind of stuck.

All that to say perhaps they have problems with how the house was built in that the air flow isn't what it should be. Maybe they just need the extra fans to keep things cool or perhaps they try not to use the AC at night when it isn't as hot.

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Originally posted by Mango2009:
So why do the Duggars think that Tacos and spaghetti are international foods?

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Originally posted by Mango2009:
So why do the Duggars think that Tacos and spaghetti are international foods?

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Originally posted by arnaras:
I would just about eat my hat if the Duggars knew what bulgoki, tonkatsu, or dim sum were. (A common Korean dish, a common Japanese dish, and a common Chinese meal.)

I'm sorry, but if your experience is with Taco Bell, The Olive Garden (which I do love), and Panda Express with regards to international food, then no, I wouldn't consider that to be really international at all.

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Originally posted by mom9900:

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Originally posted by arnaras:
I would just about eat my hat if the Duggars knew what bulgoki, tonkatsu, or dim sum were. (A common Korean dish, a common Japanese dish, and a common Chinese meal.)

I'm sorry, but if your experience is with Taco Bell, The Olive Garden (which I do love), and Panda Express with regards to international food, then no, I wouldn't consider that to be really international at all.

Well I'll admit I don't know about the 1st 2 but knew the 3rd was chinese.

And sorry, as long as I have the Olive Garden and Don Pablo's as far as Internat'l foods are concerned the rest can stay away. Give me breadsticks and salad at the Olive Garden and I am in heaven. Yum Yum.

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Originally posted by Crabitha8675309:
I have to go with the Duggars on this one....
( but keep in mind I've been told I'm one of the pickiest eaters in the universe.) My
international foods would consist of French toast, French fries, and all the foods they listed! I'm the one you see with a plate full of plain rice or just jello from the chinese buffet- My children are much more adventuresome when it comes to meals. I'll help them cook just about whatever they want, but I just can't make myself eat it. I think some people are a lot better at this stuff than others! My son recently went to Korea for some blackbelt training. They were told to take immodium along as they were going to need it! After one day, he adapted and thoroughly enjoyed a wide variety of cuisine. I on the other hand would have been riding a little bike around looking for an oasis of some Golden Arches.

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Originally posted by Crabitha8675309:
Yeah, I am pretty much cemented and duct taped in that zone! Believe it or not, I have improved over time...but it's hard! Not to get too distasteful over the whole Korean food thing, but here's what my son said... The great grandmaster had told them the food and culture would be way different than what they've ever had. The harder they trained and the better they presented, the better resaturants he'd take them to. He told them to bring immodium as they'd be "riding the motorcycle". He then did a little demo equipped with sound effects. The motorcyle is the toilet, and the engine, and sounds of it are , well, you know. They did well, and my son's favorite part was kobe (?) beef. I'm not sure if this is spelled right, but that's what it sounded like. He said it was really good, and humored his mother by saying, no it doesn't taste like chicken! The GGmaster may have catered his advice knowing he had a group with very little experience outside the midwest. In any regard, it was a trip of a life time. My son said he learned more from those 10 days than a whole year of school and is already saving his money for the 2011 trip!

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Originally posted by Crabitha8675309:
Yeah, I am pretty much cemented and duct taped in that zone! Believe it or not, I have improved over time...but it's hard! Not to get too distasteful over the whole Korean food thing, but here's what my son said... The great grandmaster had told them the food and culture would be way different than what they've ever had. The harder they trained and the better they presented, the better resaturants he'd take them to. He told them to bring immodium as they'd be "riding the motorcycle". He then did a little demo equipped with sound effects. The motorcyle is the toilet, and the engine, and sounds of it are , well, you know. They did well, and my son's favorite part was kobe (?) beef. I'm not sure if this is spelled right, but that's what it sounded like. He said it was really good, and humored his mother by saying, no it doesn't taste like chicken! The GGmaster may have catered his advice knowing he had a group with very little experience outside the midwest. In any regard, it was a trip of a life time. My son said he learned more from those 10 days than a whole year of school and is already saving his money for the 2011 trip!

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Originally posted by Crabitha8675309:
Good Grief! That kicks the you know what out of my chicken strips meal. That's just insanity. Is there some kind of special Japanese cow this stuff comes from?

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Originally posted by arnaras:
Yes, actually. They're a special breed, and over in Japan, they're give daily massages as well as a daily ration of beer. It's thought that the happier the cow, the better the beef.

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Originally posted by demor:

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Originally posted by arnaras:
Yes, actually. They're a special breed, and over in Japan, they're give daily massages as well as a daily ration of beer. It's thought that the happier the cow, the better the beef.

I think the Japanese are on to something. A daily massage and beer makes me happy.

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Originally posted by TXgoatmama:
And those beauteous boozy bovines get massages, too!

I'm a goat mama, a cow mama, a sheep mama, a cat mama, a dog mama a chicken mama a turkin mama and a human mama.

I oughta get lots of stuff for Mother's Day. What's up with that?