-Impressions of Experiment- I am a bit let down that you gave up on this myth after 2 televised attempts. I read this entire topic and have seen many PLAUSIBLE methods to prove this myth true. Tch, I suppose that in myth busters it only takes one "TRUE" to prove a myth, whereas in math, it takes only one "FALSE" to shatter a theory...i love this show.
-The Absolute REAL Solution!- not a regulator...but a Membrane!!! ie: Hankerchief or your shirt!
-My experience- I discovered this in my pool one day. I used my shirt. I made it wet then "Caught" some air at the top and brought it underwater about 4 feet. I was able to take 2 deep breaths with the air i stole from the surface.
-Application- Sink the car and have the mythbuster equipped with a hankerchief. Make a fist and wrap the hankerchief around it. Hold the bottom of the hankerchief with the other hand making a baloon-like membrane with it. Tada! Now after being submerged and puncturing the tire (or holding the pin on the valve) make the membrane(shirt or hankerchief) and just press the membrane against the air leak. It will inflate the membrane. Simply pucker up and suck some air! Some water will enter but is easily spat out with minimal air loss. So please redo this myth, people will love this, not just because its james bond, but it can REALLY SAVE YOUR LIFE! Kiss the answer, this myth is PROVED!!!!
First, they should have tried to breathe the air from the bottom of the tire instead of the top. I don't think I have ever seen it done in the movies any other way.
Air is lighter than water so if your mouth is positioned so that the air is going up into the mouth and throat, the water will be pushed out. They tried to breath air sidways which will not push out all the water - which is why he kept getting water in his mouth.
Honestly, I can't get over the fact at just how poorly this myth was tested.
Considering the fact that I and thousands if not millions of other people in the world are trained in open water certification for SCUBA diving - which requires that we practice breating from a free-flowing regulator, the tire breathing is absolutely plausible (and if tested right, it would be confirmed).
If you place your two index fingers on the side of your lips while sucking inward on a flat surface (i.e. sidewall of a tire) you will have a much more sealed suction. This will allow you to take in only the air coming out.
Didn't like the test methodology at all, even go as far as calling it sloppy.
As previously mentioned, more techniques to breathe from the tire and practice would be preferable. Two methods at 1 try each performed by a first timer are hardly conclusive imo.
Personally I only ever tried it with a old inner tube off a bicycle (not too buoyant and I didn't have a car to drive into a pool at the time ), which also gave me the luxury of being able to unscrew the valve. I also wasn't under any time pressure as I had my own scuba gear on. Forming a seal around the stem wasn't much of a hassle on this setup, getting more than half a breath out of the tiny tube was however.
The "Hero" might even have a side cutter or a mouthpiece with stem thread from Q's division. After having had to breathe from frozen free flowing 2nd stages and a 2nd stage with broken off mouthpiece, I think the breathing part of the myth is feasible.
The amount of air seems to be far more problematic. With an over-inflated, large volume tire and shallow diving depth probably less than with a "standard" tire at deeper depths, but I really have no idea what amount of air can be gotten from either. Also would be interesting to see a if second puncture on the lower half of the tire (sealable with a finger?) would give a noticeable boost to bottom time as it compensates volume from a rather stiff car tire.
Well, I hate to help perpetuate any Hollywood myths, but it does seem that this one would be possible with training, at the very least. I, too, have seen the "mermaids" who breathe from hoses.
With regard to how this myth was treated, however... While watching this segment, I was thinking that if Adam was oriented differently in the water, it might produce a better result. Instead of the usual standing position, use the water to your advantage and invert yourself, Adam!
Someone mentioned an "air cave" in the mouth, I was thinking the same. But, if Adam were facing down in the pool, as if he'd swum down to the car, I think he'd have an advantage. Head down, feet towards the surface, Adam would be working with the rising air to create an "air cave" in back of his mouth, not the top. This is the vital part, of course, since the air pocket would be in the perfect spot to be drawn into the lungs. If I'm right in my thinking, the air would push out the water in his mouth, giving him a pocket of enough breathable air to allow him to breathe without choking.
Because I was thinking this during the segment, I was disappointed that the 2 attempts we were shown didn't try anything like this. (I wonder if they tried any more attempts that were edited for the show.) Now that I am reminded of the "mermaids", I am hoping that this will be brought up again in a future episode.
What about using a 100% cotton T-shirt off your back to trap the air that escapes the tire? In Boy Scouts of America, we did that under water to conserve our breath and remain hidden.
Revisit the myth! It is actually really cool. You can also use denim pants (i.e. levis, not Abercrombie)
No real idea how far down until the air is forced through the cotton fibers in the shirt, but I honestly believe that it would bump the "busted" to a "plausible"
Ok, how you prove this myth correct is while you are letting the car pressure equalize you take off your shirt and tie it off so you create a bag. Once it is wet you can use it to catch the escaping air and hold it over your head giving you and air pocket to breathe in..
Well although I doubt a shirt will work like a bag. I know if you had a cup you can cause as air pocket. Once the cup has enough air you can breath it in. the cup is held upside down to catch the air until it fills with air upside down. Then you inhale that air and exhale the excess into the water. Then refill the cup with air.
As far as i can see, a hand cupped above your mouth sort of like covering a sneeze would work. The principal is just like air pockets trapped in underwater caverns where the air pressure pushes the water out of the pocket. With a hand cupped tight enough to capture sufficient air, hence pushing the water out of your overturned hand, one should be able to take short breaths from it so long as their hand was positioned so that the lips were at the top of the pocket. Another point of interest would be making sure that you allowed enough time between breaths to allow a water free breath. Quick gasps over escaping air does not allow enough time for air to build up sufficient pressure to push the water away from your mouth, meaning you're getting large amounts of water between air bubbles.
With advanced diving skills breathing out of a tire would be easy. First you don't suck air like everybody is trying to wright. Sucking in air will also suck in water . You cup you hand over the air and direct the bubbles into your mouth. Once the bubbles have filed your mouth it will push all the water out, then you take a slow breath. Clamping the nose will make this easy. It is a weird felling but works just fine. Second they should let a real diver do this. If the movie was based on a James Bond type they would have advanced diving skills.
As discussed by others, I too believe this to be very plausible due to my SCUBA training. I would suggest that the vehicle be placed in the water on its side to make it easy for Adam to get above the flow of air and slowly breath from the fountain of air flowing into his mouth. Or if the car is upright, perhaps try pressing the side of your mouth against the tire above the punctured hole.
Might be a double post. Funneling air, cupping hands, and the straw theory are plausible. However, adrenaline would prove quite troublesome. The membrane theory works best. The shirt bag is the best idea: I did this myself in a 12ft pool. You may also use a handkerchief. The membrane will inflate by simply pressing the surface against the air leak.
edit: to make a bag from the handkerchief in a panic underwater: 1) make a fist with first hand and "punch" the center, effectively wrapping the membrane around your fist. 2) use second hand to loosely hold the edges of the membrane against your first hand's wrist. 3) you may remove your first hand at this point or use it to assist you in pressing the membrane against the air leak. The air will pass into the membrane inflating it. There will be an amount of air lost from the membrane, but it should be tiny bubbles making a small surface distortion(stealthy.) 4) simply pucker up and kiss the membrane sucking a satisfying breath of air. be aware that some water will enter your mouth while sucking through the membrane, you can spit it out with minimal air loss.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: merkleb,
I feel that if you are staying down on threat of death you might have a bit more patience with the situation. I also feel that if you were smart enough to try that in the first place you would be calm enough to take your time.
You have two minutes and a half. At a stretch, even someone who does not practice holding their breath can hold for a minute.
So, lets say you only need to take a breath every 30 seconds.
The issue of water is solved easily. Tilt the face to the floor of the river so that the air rises to the back of your mouth, spit out the water, then breathe in. Not hard at all. I know this works (not in relation to the tire situation) in practice. I do it when I'm swimming underwater and have accidentally gotten water in my mouth along with air.
While this didn't get the usual amount of air time; it seems that it didn't get the Mythbusters "what would it take to do it?" approach.
Since Adam was having issue getting in air, I'm surprised that you didn't try hooking a breather valve to a hose to something to clip onto the tire valve. The part of this myth that seems most questionable to me is the quality of air in a tire, and how long one would be able to breathe it (irrespective of the problem of getting the air from the tire).
Although its highly unlikely anyone would have such a tool with them at the time, they could use a valve removal tool to remove the valve from the stem and then breathe the air. That way their hands wouldn't get in the way of creating a seal. But then there's the possibility that the air would be coming out to fast and cause their lungs to pop.
So why would you want to put nitrogen in a tire? So if I was to remove the valve from the stem of a notrogen filled tire and and put a flame near the stem with the nitrogen rapidly escaping, would that turn the tire into a flame thrower?
I think you were a little quick to bust this one & here's why: As a commercial diver & NAUI scuba instructor I have successfully sipped air from many freeflowing sources including scuba tanks w/out regs (a very old & out dated skill no longer taught) and 1/8" ID pneumofathometer hoses (a required skill in commercial diver training). The trick is in the sipping VERY slowly & exhaling COMPLETELY between breaths. Yes, you will get some water but keeping the tounge up will block most of it which can then be spit out during the exhale. I noticed Adam give a burp & go back to breathing without really exhaling completely, this is understandable as exhaleing underwater isn't natural, but for this myth it's vital because holding the breath only builds CO2 which causes you to want to breathe more and so on... The air pressure required isn't that much either & only a few p.s.i. over ambient will provide a nice stream of bubbles to SIP from. If there is 4.32 psi of pressure at the bottom of a 10' deep pool then 8-10 psi ought to be great. In dive school we used hoses instead of tires and spent several minutes at 15' breathing off a pressure equal to 30 fsw (about 12.96 psi). Excluding the environmental & situational considerations mentioned in the show I would assume our hero would be cool headed enough & have a good enough understanding of physiology to make this a plausable myth.
So if I was to remove the valve from the stem of a notrogen filled tire and and put a flame near the stem with the nitrogen rapidly escaping, would that turn the tire into a flame thrower?
Nitrogen gas isn't flamable. I believe it becomes an oxidizer when combined with oxygen to make a "nitrous bottle" for car engines.
Nitrogen makes up something like 70% of the atmosphere, so I think we would be in trouble if it burned that well.
Also, nitrogen is used in food packaging, like potato chip bags, to keep the chips fresher longer.
By the way, for those thinking that water is rushing into the tire, I don't think it will "rush in" until the air pressure in the tire (about 30psi, give or take) falls below the pressure of the water at whatever depth the tire was at. Even then, in the case of the knife cut, it would probably only be a trickle since the rubber would partially seal the hole somewhat.
I think it's interesting that Adam's hair and goatee were short in the tire breathing segment, similar to the way he was wearing them when they first did the sinking car myth, as opposed to long/full, the way he's been wearing them lately and the way he appears in the other parts of this episode.
Things that make you go "Hmmmm?". (I wish they would just say that they're showing a segment that they didn't air previously.)
Well the first thing I thought was: If the person is some type of spy or even just a regular person. If you have a simple bic pen in your car and a pocket knife(which many people now carry((Cast Away)), you could puncture the tire, like adam did, with the knife and cut off both ends of the pen. You now have a perfect air straw, to put in the hole of the tire, and use your finger to cover the hole between breaths(Hide bubbles). A spy might be trained in such things. Many of us aren't, but it was the first thing that came to me. Possible....I think so.
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), which also gave me the luxury of being able to unscrew the valve. I also wasn't under any time pressure as I had my own scuba gear on. Forming a seal around the stem wasn't much of a hassle on this setup, getting more than half a breath out of the tiny tube was however.
