Boy oh boy would I like to combine the climbing device with the nail firing device, and use a small grapple instead of the nail firing device(beautiful idea that WILL also work, Maybe in conjunction or interchangable). Use them on everyday structures instead of army base grade concrete. I also see real potential for rockclimbing devices!!

I forgot two things; First I misspelled my own name, awesome!(Oxfords Vengeance, anyway), Second, I love you guys, your show, and the discovery channel in general. Oh and of course Kari . good luck with the program! I'll be watching.

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Originally posted by mtnrsq94:
Jamie was just inches from falling to the ground!

I watched that part again here's about how it went: Jamie - Well I made it to the top and I'm stuck. Let me just whack this line with a knife...uh, better not slash the rope too (his blade looks like it actually contacts the belay line) Poop! Now I'm falling over backwards and I'm using a winch to bludgeoning myself with one hand and the other hand has a nasty sharp thing in it. What can I do to steady myself? I'll just hook my wrist around the rope and hope I don't stab myself with the knife. Poop! Not steady enough, I hope I don't flip completely upside down and fall out of my harness because I don't have a chest harness on. Whew... made it.
Normally I really respect Jamie but his exit strategy could've used some work on this one.

quote:

Originally posted by mtnrsq94:

quote:

Originally posted by cipher1024:
Never before have I watched an episode and cringed at the flagrant lack of safety as much as I did on this one. As one person earlier noted Jamie unsteadily hacking off the grappling line that is mere inches from the safety rope and smashing his face with his winch was pretty bad. Jez, use the lift or something. Add to that, Adam flinging what is basically a loaded .22 around and the build team nearly being decapitated by a flying cannon and you've got a formula for cancellation due to decapitation. If they were a rock band, their drummer would have died on this show for sure. I love the show and I don't want it to end, so guys please be a little more careful.

As a mountain rescue profesional, I cringed the moment Jamie pulled out the knife! We never use knives around life/safety ropes unless there is absolutely the last resort. Watch the replay and note how close Jamie came to cutting his belay line.

When you actually test it, it takes very little cutting force to sever a rope in tension...just a slight touch will do it.

Jamie was just inches from falling to the ground!

I am with you on that one. They really need to spend some more time on their rope skills, Jamie should have pulled himself up and had his belayer lock him off so he could have unloaded the winch; and then if necessary cut the line. The first fall also had Adam in pretty bad shape considering how minor a fall it was.

Adam's grapple gun was good but I thought he could have done a better job. He should have used a small rod inside a bullet case. If you think about it, you need something to penetrate a wall, and bullets can do that in a pinch. So, if you make a rod-bullet-thingy...with a wire hook on it that can fit into a grapple gun **Cough** Welrod**Cough** that has enough grip space or body to hold a spindle wit the wire, then your set. This of course would only be for zip stuff or climbing. To add a motor...eh let me tink about it for a while. Ill have my friend make a 3D render...if thats allowed that is. All in all, i really enjoyed this episode. =P

(Just in case Adam reads this::::If you think its any good Adam, give it a try...I think you've already done something similar to this already.)

For the Belayers comments.
Jess was tied off as the base holder. Adam was a secondary holder, and therefor not tied off.
I think that if they had thought it out for a few more minutes, they would have used the lift to get Jamie down, but he probably wanted down then, not waiting, and that lift dragging on his arm probably hurt. Try holding your entire weight on a device strapped to your arm. It hurts after a short while.
So he made a mistake, I think they do that from time to time, because they are AVerage Joe, not a climbing specialist, or a rocket scientist. It was dangerous and I'm super glad he didn't get hurt worse than he did. Same old stoic response though... Adam would have been flailing about and hooting with pain.. we see Jamie go "Ow, well I just hit myself in the face rather hard."
I hope they get to revisit so they can do more SuperHero Myths.
Oh, and a DRILL head for the concrete wall? Ummm yeah, what's gonna hold that drill action against the concrete wall? It doesn't work that way in the real universe where physics has to be appeased.

did they fire all the researchers? because there is already a hand held battery operated climbing device. it was made for the department of defense advanced research projects agency (DARPA), and its not classified. if you search Google for something like "battery powered grappling hook" you can find it. its called "PowerQuick" heres the manufacturers website http://www.quointech.com/PowerQuick1.htm

just a little more research would be nice, i know they have a schedule to keep, but please don't sacrifice the science for "TV"

quote:

Oh, and a DRILL head for the concrete wall? Ummm yeah, what's gonna hold that drill action against the concrete wall? It doesn't work that way in the real universe where physics has to be appeased

I would suggest vacuum pads. Pads clamp device to wall using suction, drill head drills hole using expanding diamond tipped bit, then expands said bitto lock into the hole. It would take a few minutes to drill the hole and set the anchor, but at least it would work. You would need something like a flying wing to hit the wall squarely so the suction pads could operate, but you could radio control it for greater accuracy. Not so much like the superheroes grappling gun, more of a grappling unmanned air vehicle - but it could probably work.

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I have a mock-up of a concrete nail imbedding grappling hook hanging in my shop along side the GI Joe with a working rope climber model.

So how does it work - do you launch a gun at the wall as Adam did, or do you use a super high velocity sabot round with a high density dart? What stops the projectile from pulling back out of the hole it just made, as happened to Adam?

I agree with most of the explosive bolt ideas. The easiest way to do this would be to adapt that classic of whaling, the harpoon. The harpoon design is strong enough to hold onto a 60 ton whale connected to an even heavier ship. The way it could work is to use a longbarreled pistol or revolver with a magnum charge and a tempered steel small harpoon. Just like a real harpoon the end would stick out of the gun, and would have a fin that both locks the harpoon in place and trails the line connected to Jamie's wench. a large gunpowder charge (say .45 magnum) should give enough mass to the harpoon to allow it to penetrate concrete, brick, or other typical siding provided the shape was correct. I am actually surprised that's what adam didnt go for, since that's typically what batman's model is typically rendered as.

James

Adam`s grappling launcher`s mistake was newtons 2nd
law 9for every action their is an appropriate reaction.
when the nail was launched at the wall the explosion forced it backwards so that the force went backwards against the wall.
Adam rebuild it IT WILL WORK!

I agree with most of what's been said here. It seems to me that the best way to do this is to use a tried and true method: the harpoon. The harpoon idea is sufficient to hold a 60 ton whale in tow. The way to do it here would be to use a long barrel pistol or revolver, and have a small harpoon that fits in the barrel with the point sticking out the end. A small tempered stainless steel harpoon should work, with a fin/head on the end that is hard and narrow enough to attach a cable to. That cable is attached to Jamie's wrist wench. a large cartridge should be more than sufficient to penetrate most walls. I wonder why Adam didnt use this approach to begin with because this is a very common rendering of batman's grappler

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I like the fact that they tried to scale the building themselves. But, you knew it was coming, the myth calls for a person in extemely good physical condition. The sonar emiting flying mammal man trained since he was 8 years old, at least that is how the story goes. Get somebody who does rock climbing or search and rescue in the mountains to retry this myth.

While their upper body strength/skill was part of the issue, the main part of the issue was that they were trying to use the thinnest line available that would hold their weight (in keeping with the Batman myth of using the really small diameter line to scale buildings)

A line that small in diameter simply cannot be gripped tightly enough to be climbed. You cannot close your hand around it enough to grip it.

Though the Prusik knots worked very well, they are just slow going. Though the Prusiks could have been used a little faster with a larger diameter rope. Larger takes a lot of the fumbling with small knots out of the equation.

I actually have an idea for somethign Adam could do with his rig. I own a Yugoslavian SKS. This rifle has a grenade launcher port of the barrel to hold a 20mm grenade.(you fire it using a blank round)
Now I am sure Adam could do something with this. It could also probably be used to launch a hook as well.
Oh yeah....This gun is ILLEGAL in Kalifornia... Well, if I can find a 20mm dummy grenade, I might try to make it launcher a spike or hook.

When jamie first tried to climb the building with the grappling hook and the Prusik knot( Wikipedia Prusik Knot) if he were to use two, one under the other, one on the right hand and right foot, th other on the left hand and foot, he could climb much faster. If he stands on the bottom one, and pushes the top one up, he can slide the bottom up and then repeat that. That is the technique that the US. Army Rangers use. I think he should try again with two instead of just one.

There is also a military special ops "Gun/launcher" called the maghook and you can find a "pic" of it at http://matthewreilly.com/vaultswf.htm but you have to look around for it

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Originally posted by tennisballdoorunlocker:

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Originally posted by rka1010:
I found Adam and Jamie's attempt at this entertaining, but the fact that they would bust this myth on their timeline and budget is both arrogant and ludicrous. Remember that Batman's alter ego was the billionaire Bruce Wayne, which is how all of his equipment was financed. Do you not think that a billion dollars couldn't be put into research to find something exponentially better than what Adam built in one day from junk parts?!

Wow

I think if u use a skull shaped ring instead of a square ring it would work better . a square ring apply equal presser which leaves a square shaped make . where at list a skull shaped ring would skull shaped make

I am with myth_man_mageddo, a smaller Nitro blaster...

Harpoons go into flesh, not into concrete. Find a thing that goes into concrete(without smashing it to pieces mind you).
A .45 round will still make it bounce off.
A suction cup won't stick to rough concrete.
Think it through, all these ideas would work prefectly in a non-reality comic book. Try applying physics to them.
Anything that hits with enough force to go through the concrete, isn't going to drill a neat little hole, it's going to take a chunk out.
A drill only works if there's something ot hold it to the wall, and throwing a suction cup at a rough wall won't make it stick, it will bounce off. Suction usually needs a great deal of finesse to apply, think of these ones Adam used in his wall walkers. He had to stick them on carefully each time, or they wouldn't stick. It's a precision thing, not something you shoot across fifty feet or more into a unforgiving wall that isn't slick enough for suction to work in the first place.
All these ideas for shooting something through the wall need additional physics. Concrete isn't designed to be penetrated. Harpoons are too large to go through without making a sizable crater, which then is too large for spikes to hang onto. Not to mention.. harpoons, SKS guns, grenade launchers.. umm.. hello? Belt size?? They wouldn't work to start with, but remember that whole belt size criteria?
And if you watch Jamie's ascent with the ropes and knots, he did have two knots. He used one foot then the other. Ten minutes was a great time to ascend that far using that method. It's just not a super-quick way to get up a line, but it is effective.

quote:

Originally posted by wolfy-hound:
Harpoons go into flesh, not into concrete. Find a thing that goes into concrete(without smashing it to pieces mind you).
A .45 round will still make it bounce off.

The SKS uses a 7.62X39 round. It can lob a heavy grenade pretty far. So I am sure it could launch a small spear/spike/nail pretty far and hard