I'm upset with the testing of the ring impression myth because in the test with the punch at the strength of a heavyweight boxer, the bottom of the knuckles hit it's forehead. I think it would work if the flat part of the ring hit the flat part of the forehaed at the speed of the heavyweight boxer. Thanks for listening, Michael
ok, this is a superhero world? anything can happen. right??
suppose the super speed of the punch caused massive air friction and that superheated the metal ring? the face of the ring would BRAND the surface onto the villain.
note to Grant. heat the ring with a torch and then punch the pig skin/skull. S-Puppet
Greetings, as an old time Phantom phan, I recall the newspaper comics years ago discribing the two rings he wore. One was the skull ring, which was impregnated with an ink to leave a permanent mark on the criminal. I think the ring was similar to a tattoo needle. The other mark was left with a ring on the left hand that showed others that the person was under the protection of the Phantom, and The Ghost Who Walks would lightly touch the the person and leave the mark.
In my capacity as a JC baseball umpire, I was once hit in the forearm by a foul tip while behind the catcher. I was left with the scar of an imprint of the laces of the baseball that stayed visible for over two weeks! Maybe not a signet ring, but the impression was there.
1) You need a better human analog... dead pig skin stretched over a dry skull is not a good enough analog for living human flesh.
Even dead human flesh will react differently to an impact than living human flesh... you need to do this on something living...
2) You didn't even test all the rings you made much less all the types of rings.
A ring shaped more like a cattle brand would be more likely to leave a mark.... a ring with sharpened blade like edges would be even more likely.
3)The myth talked about leaving scars a series of cuts would heal into scar tissue... scar tissue forms after an injury not during hence the need to do this on living tissue.
Living Human skin will never hold a permanent imprint but it will hold temporary imprints or a permanent scar.
Dead tissue will, under the right conditions, hold a permanent imprint (just ask any leather worker), but will never scar.
A more appropriate analog might be a living pig. But there is no way to accurately test this without a living anolog.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: jjdafoe,
A ring can leave an inprint if you're punched with one. I know some people who have been on the wrong end of a ring punch and they were left with a mark.
However I don't think it's possible to leave any perminate mark. The people I know who were marked by a ring the inprint faded in about a day.
I don't think it's the force of the punch that leaves the mark but rather just the pressure of the actual contact.
Props to Mythbusters for having an interesting new episode.
With that said ... Ring to leave a scar.
what leaves a scar, living tissue, blood, etc. cannot leave a scar if you the target doesn't bleed. how about leaving an impression? you can tell definitely from the show that their pneumatic fist never hit from the right angle. the pinky always hit the top of the head (except of the last skull breaking punch) also, use a ring the extends outward, not inward. try from the side or straight at a flat surface.
We've all slapped a buddy on the back, slept on a tile floor. Had wrinkle impressions from underwear that was too tight. all would leave an impression.
I think a punch to a face could easily break skin or even leave an impression in the form of the object that blew the strike. base ball to the face, soccer ball to the gut, even hickeys to the neck (or other parts) easily leave an impression.
would have like to see better effort towards this task.
would like to see this revisited with other super hero myths.
I think the ring myth needs more exploration. I play baseball and when you get pegged the seam marks of the baseball leave distinct bruises. I could definitely see i ring mark bruise being left in the shape of a bruise, any thoughts?
I have watched an actual fight where someone got punched in the forehead and it left a impression. Not permanent but lasted a good 2-3 hours. Just figured i would toss it out there.
I liked the idea, but I agree it could have been done further. It was just skin on skull. I feel it needed some fat tissue and muscle. Then maybe it could have left a mark. Instead of going for scar, maybe indentation as someone talked about earlier.
They definitely need to retest. I have actually left a ring impression scar on someone before (we were both drunk, and I got something from it too...)
1. The ring was indented. This is not ideal for leaving any impression bseides a rectangle.
2. The angle of the punch was always not direct. Most human punches involve wrist movement so that the punch remains actually imparting energy for far longer.
3. While the head would move backwards, there are tendons and a spinal column not quite followed in the test.
I disagree with the "Busted" conclusion, it depends on the part of the body being hit. A friend of mine was kicked by a horse in the lower left side, right near the bottom of the ribs. He had a wonderful horseshoe indentation, complete with the nail holes of the horseshoe 18 months after being kicked. I haven't seen him in years, so I don't know if it eventually went away or not.
Well guys I know for a fact that the rings can leave a certain mark. Ive done, I hit my brother once with my class ring and it deffinately left its imprint for 2 weeks. They hit dead skin that could not react with a mark. Its dead. Need actuall live skin with blood flow.
In response for your request for ideas about a human analogue:
That's why this myth is so hard to prove. But there are so many stories of people receiving imprints on their face from rings and other objects that it's definately worth trying. I normally don't object to the Mythbusters methodology, but simply stretching pig skin over a bare human skull gave me serious doubts. But using people or live animals as the test subjects is out of the question too. Maybe one of the Mythbusters or crew members can agree to have some of their skin grafted (like with burn victims), and I hear that skin can be preserved for a short period of time.
And as for the punching rig, you take a ring or other object and simply press it moderately to the skin of your face for several minutes, you'll create an imprint. So the issue isn't power or force, it's technique. A fist-punching machine simply can't cut it. Or at least try a few attempts with real people wearing the ring and punching the grafted skin.
OK, you asked for more methods, I’ve actually seen this done for forensic testing. I’m a retired Xray Tech and have worked for many years in Emergency Rooms, so I’ve X-rayed hundreds of patients facial bones after they have been hit by many different objects.
Mikencr has the design of the ring right for making the proper impression/cut on a face or skin. The main thing being the ring needs to be sharp, sharp enough to cut the skin when it’s hit. The cut will heal into a scar shaped like the ring. If there is ink or some foreign matter in the ring you may get coloration of the scar, but the cut is the important thing.
The rig I saw used in the forensic lab didn’t need pig skin or anything painful to prove. The guys put the ring on a dowel rod, and hit a pile of paper/carbon/paper sheets. The target was about an inch thick and was nothing but alternating sheets of paper and carbon paper, the result was very interesting. The top sheets would show a cut like the skin did, and the deeper sheets showed what the bruise looked like. They didn’t need to hit the subject with thousands of newtons of force, just a simple knock with the stick. And they could also control the angles of the hit and the position of the rings. If you still want to use the pig analog, all you need to do is hit the carcass and then look to see if the skin was cut, or place a carbon sheet over the skin and see if the image of the ring transfers when it’s hit.
No matter how in shape you are there is a small layer of fat under everyone's skin, which if I am not mistaken would help to leave an impression. This one should have been really easy. Take the eraser out of a pencil press the metal to your forhead with hardly an pressure and you will get a nice circle impression. Push hard enough you can break the skin and you could be left with a permanent scar.
hi, i just watched the episode and i thought, you are doing it all wrong... first of all.. you can see how the punch hits not strait on, and thats why you just got a scarr instead of a actual mark
second of all... if they ring had sharper edges there would be higher chance of it actualy being a skull mark
i know this myth IS possible because i actualy got a scarr on my wrist (not ring, was something i played with as little) that has perfect shape up to this day (somewhere between 10-15 years) and yeah, wrist aint same as the head but in the comic you showed, the punch was actualy not on the skull, but rather on the cheek which is allot more skin
and also... by actualy using real flesh would also increase the success rate
and by the way, the mark i got didnt even cause bleeding... i simply pressed something (i belive it was a pen or something, was too long ago to remember) with child strength
try pushing a piece of wood or whatever on any part of your body just even a little while and it will leave a temporary mark... pushing harder and longer can make it permanent like mine.... and if you applied this to a trained punch, it could be a clearly visible scarr
Originally posted by kiltedbiker: Greetings, as an old time Phantom phan, I recall the newspaper comics years ago discribing the two rings he wore. One was the skull ring, which was impregnated with an ink to leave a permanent mark on the criminal. I think the ring was similar to a tattoo needle. The other mark was left with a ring on the left hand that showed others that the person was under the protection of the Phantom, and The Ghost Who Walks would lightly touch the the person and leave the mark.
You're absolutely correct. The "evil" ring had a jagged edge and was impregnated with the juice of the banga bush (same bush that the Bandars use for their poison arrows) and thus it would leave a kind of tattoo as well as a scar. The "good" ring just had the banga bush juice on it.
However this myth might not be able to test properly (as jidafoe points out) without the show getting in trouble with the ASPCA...
I don't think there is any question that you can leave an impression, but it may depend on a couple of factors.
My reasoning is that many years ago I was playing soccer and as a fullback, defending a shot on goal that I managed to block squarely mid-thigh. It was an extremely hard kicked shot. I was very definitely left with the clear imprint of a soccer ball on my thigh, with the 5 sided patterns and everything. No doubt whatsoever.
These were bruises of a sort, a reaction of the blood and so forth, so using dead pigskin ain't gonna do that. And I don't know if it matters, but it was damn cold at the time.
When I was a kid in high school, I had a skull ring. It was anatomically correct, as to the features of a real skull, except for the red crystals for the eyes. Several of us wore these rings, as they were quite popular in our area, and a store that was perenially going out of business was well-stocked with the rings. I had the opportunity, due to a number of fights, to see people with skull marks on the faces and foreheads. I would have to agree that dead tissue cannot develop a bruise or other minor injury. That is one way the medical examiner can determmine time of death, and whether an injury is pre- or post-mortem. I agree that someone's bicep area would be a good substitute for the face in a test of this sort.
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