I don't need to add to what everyone else has already said in the EAMTs' defense, but I do have one point to make: if every animal rescued by the EAMTs - not just in Phoenix, but everywhere - and they all got happy endings, would anyone really take animal cruelty seriously? I know I wouldn't - I would think, "Oh, that's too bad that that animal was mistreated, but it all worked out in the end so it's not that serious." When these animals die despite all the EAMTs do to save them, it sends out a strong message: Animal cruelty IS serious, and DOES kill animals. It really makes people stop and take animal cruelty seriously. If no animals died, it wouldn't be as dire and so in need of being stopped.

Think about it.

A good point that was brought up in an earlier post. I like some of the things Animal Planet did with this show but that is the one main sticking point that the producers keep missing the mark on. Not every story has a happy ending. I remember when Animal Precinct came out, they ended every story with a happy ending. They have done this with every show I have ever watched that was on that level. It seems to be a trend with AP.
Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix started off good but I have to agree the trend has continued with the fluff up in the end, with the message against animal cruelty being diluted. I also found another dynamic with Animal Planet is that they seem to ignore the smaller rescues. In fact more media should be covering them.

With the AP Heroes: Phoenix series they never mention the fact that the AHS works with other rescues like AzCATs, AAWL and Sun Cities 4PAWS. These 3 organizations don't get half the recognition the AHS does, and they operate on very limited budgets. It is a shame that when people watch this show they get the idea that the AHS is the only rescue that exists in Phoenix when in fact their are many. I think the same can be said with the Animal Cops shows as well as Animal Precinct.

The other rescues also have their fair share of problems just like the AHS does. AAWL for example just announced that adoptions are being harmed because of the light rail project. Yes, our local government does what they can to harm the animal rescue community and local businesses by ripping up roads for something the citizens never wanted.

That is a different topic altogether but AAWL like the other no-kill shelters has many cats that are still waiting to be adopted. Many rescued from the euthanasia list from AC&C. They like the smaller rescues have also rescued animals from the AHS as well. Even with that fluff you won't find Animal Planet wanting to report on that. I guess doing stories of smaller rescues and no-kills are not interesting enough for them so I doubt highly you'd see their production crew wandering around the 4PAWS shelter.

One question that comes to mind is this. Just how many shows on the EAMT crew will they be able to do before they run out of stories? Eventually there has to be an end to the series before people either get tired of it or Animal Planet says they've had enough. Most often a show finally gets cancelled when people stop watching. I can think of plenty of shows that got a following but were cancelled because the producers simply ran out of ideas because they tried to squeeze too much out of the show. Look at Emergency Vets. That show was cool to watch but now it is only shown in repeats. I'd have to guess they simply ran out of stories or people eventually stopped watching.

I stopped watching Animal Cops and Animal Precinct because it was the same type of story every day it was on. AP Heroes: Phoenix is kind of going the same route. I think what they should have done with the show is do a season with the EAMTs and then did another season at a different shelter in the Phoenix area. Their title of Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix misses the mark in a way. A lot of rescues here in Maricopa County certainly qualify under the word heroes and certainly deserved to be recognized.

AAWL and the like may not have the animal paramedics but they do work with emergency and regular vets when an animal is injured. In fact, the other rescues have also been an asset to the AHS. AzCATs is the perfect example of this. They specifically deal with the feral cat issue in the Phoenix metro area. If not for them, the AHS would be freely accepting and euthanizing feral cats. Now the AHS charges people for feral cats brought into their shelter and also tries to convince them to work with AzCATs which does the trap, neuter, return method of handling the issue. The EAMTs carry information cards with the AzCATs info to hand out to the public when they go on calls.

Also, at the AHS Campus for Compassion shelter they have information on the TNR program that AzCATs has. It took a very long time for AzCATs to convince the AHS and AC&C that TNR was the best solution when it comes to feral cats. Now that is heroism. This group definately deserves a lot of respect. Right now, they are having a volunteer shortage which pretty much prevents them from helping more of the public deal with the ferals. They definately need donations and more public support just like many of the rescues out there and their service to the community is extremely vital. The AHS as a whole is not equipped to deal with the feral cat issue. They did however this past October help AzCATs in the goal of spaying and neutering 1,196 feral cats. AHS volunteered their Second Chance Hospital to help perform some of the surgeries. This is not something Animal Planet nor the local media even mentioned. The only one to mention it was Cat Galaxy.

It took a long time for a lot of the rescues to work together on anything. It used to be that every rescue was an island. Now they have to work together for the benefit of the animals. That's not to say that each groups won't have their disagreements with each other but at least they are out there working for the same goal.

Catprotector, I really enjoy all of the comments from people that don't live in Arizona like us. I find their questions and comments very interesting and very helpful in ways that maybe haven't been looked at before. But when I read your reply to almost every one posted, you always have something negative to say! How Animal Planet should be doing a show with AzCATs and the AHS isn't the only group of people helping animals. But I think you keep forgetting that the only reason this message board has any questions or comments is because there is a TV show on Animal Planet called Animal Plant Heroes PHOENIX!

I can't help but wonder if you are jealous or mad that they are getting recognition and AzCATs is not! Maybe the reason the show is on the EAMTs and not on AzCATs is that the EAMT program is literally unique, and AzCATs is not? (Not that what they are doing does not deserve recognition.)

You said that every series has to end and they will eventually run out of stories to show. Maybe, but Cops is the longest running show in TV history because, unfortunately, people will always break the law and it makes for good TV! And the same rule applies here with Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix, there will always be some kind of animal cruelty and animals in distress that need help whether we like it or not and it also makes for good TV! This TV show will go on as long as Animal Planet wants it to, no matter what anyone says.

I can't help but think that you want them to fail based on your own personal feelings! The EAMTs will continue to do their jobs with or without Animal Planet! (Like they always have) That alone make them heroes! I know for a fact that not one of them have ever said that we deserve all this recognition! The EAMTs didn't ask for this show; they are happy for it because of the fact that it brings to light a lot of problems in animal welfare. Seeing the problems that occur in Phoenix may just prompt people to work on the problems in their own area, and that is a great thing.

Personally, I don't think that people are that uneducated to believe that the EAMTs are the only salvation for the animals! Of course there are many other organizations and if you really feel that strongly about AzCATs having their own show, then maybe you should write Animal Planet instead of putting down the EAMTs who never even asked for this, unlike you!

Hypothetically, let's say AzCATs has its own show on Animal Planet. Do you post on their message board that they aren't the only organization helping animals in Phoenix? If that is really your point then you should, because what you keep saying about the AHS and the EAMTs and the show Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix would apply to their show, wouldn't it?

I really hope that you will answer that last question, because I already know that you will have a long winded reply!

SS&C

It has nothing to do with jealousy. It has a lot to do with the fact that the smaller organizations are being excluded with shows like this. It's a pretty known fact that when the average person thinks about animal rescue or a shelter in Phoenix they think either AC&C or the AHS. Not too many think about AzCATs, AAWL, 4PAWS, Foothills, or any of the other smaller groups. A lot of it has to do with the media so I don't blame the AHS at all. Does it upset me that the smaller groups or no-kills get excluded from shows like this. You bet, because the side effect is it puts the focus on one group while excluding all the others. In thinking about it, I also started thinking the same thing when it came to Animal Cops, and even Animal Precinct. It focused on one organization and didn't mention any other rescue. Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix is done in the same way only I have seen them mention AC&C and a wildlife rescue. Other than that they are going the same route as the other shows they've done.

I highly admit I'm a fan of the smaller rescues and no-kill shelters and proud of it as well. I think their work in the community is valuable and it should be noted big time. The public needs to know about the services many of them provide. I think the media should definately cover them more often and do what they can to help raise money for them like Channel 15 does every year with the AHS PetTelethon. Sadly, the smaller rescues get excluded from stuff like that. Heck, even AC&C and AAWL don't get their own TV show.

As for AzCATs not being unique, that isn't true. They are the only group in the Valley and Arizona that specifically deals with feral cats. They don't have a shelter nor do they adopt out cats. Most if not all of the local groups are going to them regarding TNR. They also work on a very small budget and partner with vets to do the low cost spay neuters. They were also the main group that convinced both AC&C and AHS to adopt TNR policies. It took a long time for AzCATs to convince them that TNR was the best way to solve the feral cat problem.

Because we have such a large feral cat population in the Phoenix area, their organization is extremely vital. They also don't get a lot of recognition from the media either. It's a real shame, considering if that organization ended its services, members of the public and other rescues would have no place to turn to for information or support on the feral cat issue. Even the EAMTs would suffer because the AHS would have no group for them to refer to when they encounter ferals and someone complains about them. AC&C would also be affected on this issue as would all the groups who rely on AzCATs for feral cat assistance. Right now, AzCATs is suffering from a volunteer shortage which is not good at all.

You probably know that volunteers are an important part of any organization but it takes a special group of people (as it does with the EAMTs) to go out and trap the cats, bring them to the clinics, have them checked in to be spayed/neutered, and then re-release them back to the colonies. Just like the EAMTs, it requires long hours, hard work and dedication.

The dedication of AzCATs is amazing. Did you know that many of their volunteers went to the the Galapagos Islands back in 2005 and on their own dime hosted a spay/neuter clinic which helped to get many cats and dogs there steralized? That was a huge undertaking. They did get some help financially from Alleycat Allies (the national organization for feral cats) which helped to raise funds but still AzCATs was very much involved and each volunteer had to spend their own money to go. Like the AHS, AzCATs also went down to help in rescue efforts after Katrina hit. And just like the Galapagos trip, the volunteers had to spend their own money. The list of what AzCATs does, unique or not is endless.

As for my own personal feelings I never said I wanted the show to fail or the EAMTs to as well. As I have stated quite a few times, I appreciate the service they are doing for the community and think that the work they do is important as well. You may be right that the EAMTs would still continue to do their job if Animal Planet left. I'd think any organization would still continue to function. But how would it affect the AHS as a whole? This show is gaining them a lot of publicity but it also leaves out so many other groups that don't get even 1/4 of the media attention that the AHS gets. A lot of the smaller rescues would love to have that kind of publicity to show the general public that they exist.

What I'm saying is that if you're going to do a show called Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix, that you design it to give all the rescues an equal shot. It gives a lot more dynamic to the show and something like that would keep the audience interested. I think it'd also show just exactly how the animal rescue community is working together as a whole and that there are other groups besides the AHS that are making valuable contributions to the public.

There are a lot of great stories that can happen with a smaller rescue. I remember one story back in 2002 where a 1 day old kitten was dumped at the side of the freeway. A volunteer from Sun Cities Animal rescue brought the kitten in, bottle fed him and then got him into foster care. Sun Valley also took care of a cat I rescued after the poor animal was not only declawed but dumped out on the streets to fend for himself. The people had moved and just left him outside. The thing about this cat is that every single movement set him off to where he'd hiss, spit and growl. I named him Ali after Mohammed Ali because was a true fighter. At times he also showed a very sweet dispostion but we believe he was also abused which explained his rather bad disposition.

Nonetheless, Sun Valley worked with him and patiently got him rehabilitated. He was eventually adopted into a family that absolutely loves him. It is that level of dedication that shows why the smaller groups deserve to be promoted.

As for the EAMTs not wanting the show, the AHS certainly wanted it. Here is a link on how it was pitched. You can read about it here.

http://www.azhumane.org/artimgr/publish/article_473.shtml

According to the information on that page, Animal Planet was looking for a new show. Herein lies the problem with it which is a side effect that is never considered. Why hasn't Animal Planet included the smaller rescues and done the show as a whole representing all the animal heroes in Phoenix? Why didn't they say "lets do the EAMTs for one season and then go to AAWL and the others for other seasons?" The same could be said about the Animal Cops and Precinct series. This has nothing to do with jealousy it has everything to do with giving equal coverage to all those in the rescue community.

In answer to your last question if AzCATs had their own series on TV, would I be posting on their own board. Absolutely, but I also know and have met many of its members and they too would want to see the other groups they work with get recognition. Their radio show The Animal World is proof of that (you can listen to it every Sunday on KFNX and on Cat Galaxy). BTW, AzCATs doesn't have their own message board so that part of your question doesn't apply. It'd be cool if they did have one because I'm sure they'd get lots of postings because feral cats is a very hot topic.

Starr, I know you are always going to be fan of the AHS which is cool. They have a lot of good programs and it is great they are working with other groups, but believe it or not the AHS does need them. To have a show that represents all the groups as a whole would truly be a wonderful thing and would put forth the message that all the groups matter. Just think, if there were a show that covers all the rescues in the Phoenix area, look how much money these organizations could raise to help the animals that are in their care not to mention the opportunity to educate the public about spay/neuter, TNR and animal cruelty. As I stated, all of the groups I'm aware of have seen the results of animal cruelty not just the AHS. A show like this also could help every rescue in their adoptions as well. The no-kills certainly could use the help. Many of their cats are in the shelter system a long time before they are adopted. AAWL for example is certainly hurting big time with the light rail project preventing people from reaching their shelter easily. As a result their adoptions are being highly impacted.

The no-kills also have taken on specialized cases where the animals might be a bit difficult to handle. The AHS certainly gets cases like this and from what I have come to understand, they now have an alternative placement department which actually does contact the other rescues to see if they can work with some of the animals that have behavior problems or simply to see if they have room to foster. Creating that department was a big step for the AHS and they deserve a pat on the back for that.

Granted I'm not always going to agree with some of the decisions that the AHS or even AC&C does make, but on that same coin I can also commend them on a lot as well. With everything in life as with organizations there's the good and the bad. Each organization has their own dynamic and way of doing things. BTW, it's important to note that one of my cats is an AHS alumni so to think I am anti-AHS simply because I point out a few flaws in the system is wrong. My posts are more well balanced than you think. BTW, I also enjoy watching Pets On Parade and seeing all the great adoption stories and even seeing some of the guests they have on it. I also like watching the Rescue Roundup where the EAMTs talk about some of the interesting rescues. I admit I prefer to only watch them talk about the cat rescues but what can you expect from a cat lover.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: catprotector,

Cat,
As has been your style, you missed the point again.

I'll start with the question that I ended with, that apparently you didn't understand.

"Hypothetically, let's say AzCATs has its own show on Animal Planet. Do you post on their message board that they aren't the only organization helping animals in Phoenix? If that is really your point then you should, because what you keep saying about the AHS and the EAMTs and the show Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix would apply to their show, wouldn't it?"

I asked, hypothetically, if you would make similar posts if there were an AzCATs message board here. I realize there isn't one, thus the word hypothetically at the beginning of the paragraph. My question wasn't if you would post there, I don't doubt you would. The question was would your posts have the same tone as the ones you make on this message board. Would you repeatedly be saying that AzCATs isn't the only organization in the Valley helping animals the way you do about the AHS? Would you still be saying that there are small organizations that do great work, not just AzCATs, the way you say about the AHS? My guess is no, because it is obvious that you have an agenda.

To further that agenda, have you proposed your show idea to AP?

Next, since you keep bringing them up, let's talk a little about AzCATs and what they do and don't do. They do alot of work as you have repeatedly stated, on Trap, Neuter, and Release programs. From what I can tell, they do a great job at that. I have come to learn that they work strictly with those groups or individuals who have feral cat colonies that they want to continue to care for. Meaning, someone contacts AzCATs and says they have a colony of 25 feral cats that they provide food and water that they want to have altered so the colony doesn't get any larger. That is something that AzCATs is more than willing to help with. If someone calls and says that there are a large number of feral cats in their area that they want removed because the caller is tired of having cats spraying urine on their doors and house and defacating in their yard, AzCATs does not help them. If the caller is not willing to maintain the colony, AzCATs does not work with them.
AzCATs also does no testing or vaccinating for communicable diseases, and considers death by disease simply a natural way to control the cat population.

So, in their specific way, they are doing their part for the cats. For that, again, they should be commended.

As far as uniqueness, the AHS's EAMTs are the only animal "paramedics" in the country, and get many calls from other communities that want to start a similar program in their area. AzCATs is not the only TNR organization in the country, so while they may be unique in Arizona, there are other organizations like theirs out there.

One final note on recognition, 2007 will mark the Arizona Humane Society's 50th Anniversary! They have been at the forefront on animal welfare and animal related issues in the Valley and the state for many years. That is why the AHS gets so much recognition and support.
People who are "dog" people and can't stand cats are not going to donate money to AzCATs but may donate to the AHS. AzCATs is a small organization that focuses on one aspect of animal welfare. The AHS is more diverse than even you, after following the EAMTs for a while, could know. That is part of the reason they have such broad support. The Alternative Placement department you mention, has always existed, just in a different form and without the distinction as a department. The AHS has always, and always will, try and place as may animals as they can.

You seem to have a big issue with the title Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix, that it gives the impression that the EAMTs are heroes and the only animal welfare workers in Phoenix. So with a different title, you would be fine with everything?

Now, can we focus on the show that does exist and stop the whining about shows that don't?

SS&C

I thought I pretty much made my point clear. If AzCATs had their own show I'd be reminding people that there are other groups that do animal rescue. I wouldn't have to remind them however because they have a radio show that promotes other groups in the animal rescue community.

Yes, the EAMTs are a unique part of the AHS where they're the only ones in the country that have the paramedic program for animals but AzCATs is also unique in their own right and are known nationally. Many of the groups that do TNR also deal with stray cats as well but AzCATs has been recognized both nationally and internationally by Alleycat Allies and other groups as being a main focal point for TNR.

I can't help but wonder if you have a problem with AzCATs because although you appear to praise them you also in the same breath seem to condemn them for the work they do. Do you realize what would happen if a group like that didn't exist in the Phoenix area? AHS and even AC&C would still be subscribing to the trap and kill method. It's because of AzCATs (and I think a few other groups but AzCATs was the main driving group)that the AHS is now promoting TNR as being the best way to deal with the situation when it comes to feral cats. No other group in the nation has pressed harder for TNR than AzCAts has. The media doesn't touch on this at all.

As for your statement of "If someone calls and says that there are a large number of feral cats in their area that they want removed because the caller is tired of having cats spraying urine on their doors and house and defacating in their yard, AzCATs does not help them." That is not true. The first thing AzCATs is try to inform the person complaining about the problem about TNR. Their first step is to educate. The second is to try and get the person to be a caretaker.

If the person refuses then AzCAts is limited in what they can do because they can't force the person to become a caretaker. As for the medical issue of ferals, with shots and stuff, the reason AzCATs doesn't do the shots is simple, there hasn't been a case of rabies in the colonies and the feral cats haven't been plagued with the other diseases that affect cats. The caretakers however may take it upon themselves to get the shots for the cats. That is always an option because the caretakers are mainly responsible for the cats they care for. When you care for a colony it is the same thing as taking responsibility and adopting them as your cats.

Right now, AzCAts has no shortage of caretakers. What they do have, is a shortage of volunteers to do the trappings. They also work on a very low budget unlike the AHS which receives plenty of donations and money. They get a lot of public and media support because and as I stated before, when someone thinks about an animal shelter or organization, the first thing that comes to the person's mind is either the AHS or AC&C. The smaller groups are working twice as hard to get the word out to the public to say "we exist."

I've worked in partnership with many of the rescues including the AHS. Recently I contributed to their food drive and also made donations to AzCATs, 4PAWS, and AAWL.

Your comment of "People who are "dog" people and can't stand cats are not going to donate money to AzCATs but may donate to the AHS," is interesting. Believe it or not you just supported my previous point that when people generally think of rescues they most commonly think of the AHS and AC&C. Once again it is mostly the fault of the media which causes this.
The reason people are so reluctant to donate to groups like AzCATs is not because of the dislike of cats but because you can't pick up and hold a feral like you would a tame stray.

To further drive home the point of your theory of dog people not wanting to donate to smaller cat rescues, AAWL works with both cats and dogs and they don't get a lot of publicity nor half the support the AHS does. Right now, the light rail progress is hurting their adoptions according to the AAWL. That is pretty big news because as you know, the AAWL is the oldest and largest no-kill facility in Arizona. Apparently adoptions at the AAWL being affected by the light rail is not important enough news to warrant a story by any of the local media (TV and newspaper). If the AHS or AC&C was in this position, the news people would be all over it. The thinking in the local media has always seemed to be that the AHS and AC&C are where the stories are at. As a result, the smaller rescues lose out while the larger ones get all the attention. This is wrong and as I stated before the AHS is not responsible for that at all.

Here is a question for you now. How would you feel if Animal Planet decided they no longer wanted to the show with the AHS and instead said they want to cover the smaller rescues? Would you be disappointed or would you be happy for these smaller organizations? It certainly would be a good thing and the show would certainly live up to its name because if you ask me, the smaller groups definately fit into the mold of heroes.

As for your question as to whether or not I'd be fine if they only changed the title (I'm guessing you mean title change and still doing it with the AHS), I don't think I would be because it would still be putting one group above another here. Why shouldn't the smaller groups be given a chance to prosper here and also have an equal voice? I'm starting to get the feeling that you frown on those who come in here to speak in support of the smaller groups. I understand that you are a fan of the AHS because your husband works for them Starr and I'm not knocking that. I think what they are doing is wonderful but I also think that just because the other groups don't have an animal paramedic program doesn't make their services any less valuable. Shows like AP Heroes: Phoenix is great to have but when you concentrate on just one group and leave out the rest then it isn't really well balanced.

As for the Alternative Placement department always exisiting, that isn't accurate. Only recently has the AHS even created that department to work with the other rescues in getting cats placed within their organization and fostered. It used to be every animal rescue organization in the Valley was their own island now they are starting to work together a bit more solidly. You state that it just existed in another form but there were still problems and many times the smaller rescues felt that the AHS was not working with them as they should've been. Now the AHS is working with them a little bit better.

It's good to see the changes the AHS has made. I thought it was great they stepped in to help AzCATs in their TNR goal of 1,196 cats this past October. I think for them to lend their hospital and staff to help spay and neuter a good number of the cats is simply wonderful. I hope this cooperative effort will continue. It's great that the EAMTs are now equipped with cards to hand out to the general public with the AzCATs contact info whenever they are faced with a citizen that has questions about feral cats.

As I have stated throughout this board, I applaud the EAMTs for their efforts. They are doing a bang up job and they are a valuable asset to the community. I also know the EAMTs value the relationship they have with smaller rescues.

In regards to the animal cruelty issue, the EAMTs are on the front lines with this issue but so are the other rescue organizations. I know of many no-kills that have taken in cats that were abuse or simply disposed of on the streets. AAWL for example like the others is a perfect example of this. When it comes to this issue, all of the rescues are fighting on the same side.

I do hope now I have answered your question because I think it is time to put this issue to rest and post about something new. The horse is definately beaten and needs to be buried.

I hope all of you have a Happy New Year and may it be a prosperous one.

I did answer your question Starr but I will attempt to explain as it somehow got lost in translation. You asked the following:

"Hypothetically, let's say AzCATs has its own show on Animal Planet. Do you post on their message board that they aren't the only organization helping animals in Phoenix?"

My answer was if AzCATs had a board I'd absolutelty post to it. I also wouldn't have to remind people out there that they aren't the only rescue in Phoenix. AzCATs is terrific in mentioning all the groups they have worked with and has brought many of them on their radio show called The Animal World which airs every Sunday morning on KFNX 1100 AM Radio & on Cat Galaxy. That show is pretty well balanced and has some very interesting guests.

As for your statement about the following:

"If someone calls and says that there are a large number of feral cats in their area that they want removed because the caller is tired of having cats spraying urine on their doors and house and defacating in their yard, AzCATs does not help them. If the caller is not willing to maintain the colony, AzCATs does not work with them."

As a matter of fact AzCATs does attempt to help them by talking to them about the benefits of TNR and how it can solve the problem. If the person is unwilling to be a caretaker there is not much AzCATs can do because they not only need permission to enter someone's property to do the trapping but also needs that person's ok to be a caretaker. There are laws that protect the property owners Starr and if the person says no there isn't much can be done. AzCATs does its best to work with people but you can't force the person to be a caretaker just like the AHS, AAWL or any of the other rescues can't force someone to be an adopter.

As for statement which said the following:

"AzCATs also does no testing or vaccinating for communicable diseases, and considers death by disease simply a natural way to control the cat population."

You are correct in the fact that AzCATs doesn't have the cats tested or vaccinated when they are brought into the spay/neueter clinics. They haven't had to because there has been no case of rabies in the colonies and the threat of the most common feline ailments hasn't happened. Also, once a person accepts being a caretaker it falls on them to get the cats their shots and if they suspect one of the cats is ill in the colony it us up to the caretaker to get that cat medical treatment not AzCATs. The same would go if you adopted a cat from a shelter, got them from a breeder, friend, etc.

As for AzCATs not being unique nationally, that statement is very incorrect. Most of the groups in the nation that deal with TNR will also deal with stray cats as a primary focus as well. AzCATs mainly focuses on the ferals and is recognized both nationally and internationally as a leading resource of TNR. They have convinced countless organizations including the AHS that TNR is the best and only route to go when dealing with feral cats. In fact, it is because of them that the AHS is now supporting TNR and even assisting AzCATs when cats need to be spayed and neutered. Before, the AHS was subscribing to the trap and kill meathod. AzCATs is very much a one of a kind group and much more diverse than you might think. There is definately a lot more to AzCATs than going out, trapping cats and getting them spayed.

In regards to your statement with AHS being on the forefront of animal welfare in the valley and animal related issues for many years, that may be so. I do know for 50 years they have been but they did start off as a smaller organization and grew in time. That is pretty much the same for many organizations. I can think of another group in Arizona that may have come into existance 14 years after the AHS but still ended up on the forefront and that is the AAWL. In fact, it still to this day is the largest and oldest no-kill facility in Arizona. Unfortunately, they like many of the other no-kills don't get even 1/4 of the recognition the AHS gets nor do they get a PetTelethon or TV show on local TV.

There is a double edged sword in the recognition category here but the reason the AHS gets recognized so much is not only because of their many animal programs (Lonely Hearts Club, Senior Placement Program are two examples) but because the media also chooses to cover them constantly. That is the not the AHS' fault but the fault of the media.

Right now, at the AAWL, the light rail project is causing serious harm to them and adoptions are being affected. Because of the construction, people are having trouble reaching their shelter. Not only that but their revenue is down $18,000 from last year. A significant hit for a rescue of their size. The news however is not covering this one. AAWL has it posted on their web site. If this happened to the AHS, the local news stations would be all over it. Recognition has a lot to do with the media. If it didn't, the AHS and other groups would probably have no need for a public relations department.

Starr, from your comments I can't help but get the feeling that you have a problem with people who speak out in favor of the smaller rescues. Shouldn't they get as much if not more recognition for the work they do? In my eyes, the animal rescue community would greatly suffer if AAWL, 4PAWS, AzCATs, Foothills, Benji's Buddies, and many of the other smaller groups disappeared. I can tell you that if it did, the larger ones like AC&C and AHS would greatly suffer because they would have nowhere to turn to when cat & kitten season happens for example. Also, the animals would suffer because more would have to be put down especially at AC&C because of space. A lot of the no-kills actually will go and rescue animals from the euthanasia list. One of them is AAWL. If they were to go under, definately both AHS and AC&C would suffer and be impacted. AAWL has worked with both, especially when it has come to difficult animals like ones with behavior issues. The other no-kills have also come to help the AHS when it's come to this issue or when they need fosters. Believe it or not sometimes the smaller rescues have resources at their disposal that the AHS doesn't. Only recently did the AHS come up with their Alternative Placement Department. Before, it was very much scattered and the groups didn't deal with each other too well. It used to be that every group was their own island but over the last couple of years it is changing because the groups realize that each has something to contribute and specialize in certain areas that another one may not have. Yes, even as big an organization as the AHS is admitted that the smaller ones have resources they don't have. In fact, it is the smaller groups that have helped to change some of AHS' policies and got them to think. As stated before it was AzCATs that was a leading force that convinced both the AHS and AC&C to adopt a TNR program when it came to feral cats. In fact because of smaller organizations AC&C was very close at one time to becoming a no-kill facility. That could happen at some point but right now it is back to being a dream.

Let's say Animal Planet did decide to say goodbye to the AHS and inform them that they are now going to cover the smaller rescues, would you have a problem with that? Would you be upset?

As for your other question about the name change , are you asking how I'd feel if the name of the show was changed but they still continue to cover the EAMTs or are you asking how I'd feel if the name was changed and they decided to cover all the groups?

If it was all the groups they wouldn't have to change the name because then they'd be staying true to the title's name. But if they changed the name and still put their focus on the EAMTs then the problem would still be the fact that they'd be focusing on one group and leaving out the others. The only thing that would change in that instance would be the title of the show. Yes, I have followed the EAMTs and even they admit that without the smaller groups assisting the AHS, their jobs would be a bit harder. On the same token, a few of the smaller rescues have also been assisted by them. This is a very good thing. I praise the work the EAMTs are doing but also can't help but being a fan of the little guy as well.

Anyway, I hope you, your cats and everyone else has a Happy New Year and safe one. Don't forget to keep your cats, dogs or whatever indoors. Also, if you are having a party keep them away from chocolate and alcohol. With the excitement of the party, one idea is to put them in a room with all their favorite toys, litterbox, food, water, and maybe turn on a radio or TV as a buffer from the noise. Cat Galaxy is a great option if you have them in the same room as the computer. See you all next year.

Cat,

Let me start with this:

"Let's say Animal Planet did decide to say goodbye to the AHS and inform them that they are now going to cover the smaller rescues, would you have a problem with that? Would you be upset?"

The answer is no. My husband and the rest of the EAMTs and the AHS as a whole would just continue to do the good work they have always done, but I am very proud of the fact that Animal Planet is doing a show on them and would be very happy if they filmed them forever.

Now, on to a few of your other points that aren't exactly true.

"You are correct in the fact that AzCATs doesn't have the cats tested or vaccinated when they are brought into the spay/neueter clinics. They haven't had to because there has been no case of rabies in the colonies and the threat of the most common feline ailments hasn't happened. Also, once a person accepts being a caretaker it falls on them to get the cats their shots and if they suspect one of the cats is ill in the colony it us up to the caretaker to get that cat medical treatment not AzCATs. The same would go if you adopted a cat from a shelter, got them from a breeder, friend, etc."

First, you can't test for rabies. It is "diagnosed" by clinical observation of symptoms but can only be definitively diagnosed through a post-mortem examination of the brain. Second, feline leukemia and feline aids are prevalent in feral cat colonies, and stray cats as a whole. Often the EAMTs are the ones who get the call to assist these animals, as well as when one gets injured.

"As a matter of fact AzCATs does attempt to help them by talking to them about the benefits of TNR and how it can solve the problem. If the person is unwilling to be a caretaker there is not much AzCATs can do because they not only need permission to enter someone's property to do the trapping but also needs that person's ok to be a caretaker. There are laws that protect the property owners Starr and if the person says no there isn't much can be done. AzCATs does its best to work with people but you can't force the person to be a caretaker just like the AHS, AAWL or any of the other rescues can't force someone to be an adopter."

My point about this is that while TNR helps, it only helps those cats that have a dedicated caretaker. Those people who call and want the cats removed would give permission for anyone to come on to their property to remove the cats. That is not something AzCATs does. There are not that many people who want to take on the responsibility of being the cats' caretaker. Some people just don't like cats. (Unlike me, I have four.)

"They have convinced countless organizations including the AHS that TNR is the best and only route to go when dealing with feral cats."

What AzCATs did in this respect was convince the AHS to try a different approach, not that TNR is the best and only route. As I stated above, and as you stated, cats that don't have a caretaker do not get assistance from AzCATs and most often remain unaltered and allowed to breed. No one knows for sure what approach will eventually solve the feral cat problem here, but the AHS decided to give a different approach a try.

"Only recently did the AHS come up with their Alternative Placement Department."

As I stated before, the distinction as a separate department has come recently, the activty that is done by the Alternative Placement department has always been done.

"My answer was if AzCATs had a board I'd absolutelty post to it. I also wouldn't have to remind people out there that they aren't the only rescue in Phoenix. AzCATs is terrific in mentioning all the groups they have worked with and has brought many of them on their radio show called The Animal World which airs every Sunday morning on KFNX 1100 AM Radio & on Cat Galaxy. That show is pretty well balanced and has some very interesting guests."

Maybe you don't understand how the production of this show works. The crews that follow the EAMTs get video and sound of everything they can. Those recordings are then forwarded to Anglia's editing and production team in England for editing where they turn the raw footage into stories for the show. They are the ones who determine what stories will air, and put together the appropriate number of stories for a show. The EAMTs and the AHS do not get to decide which stories will air, it is not like an interview show, which it seems like you are more familiar with, where you get to choose who to have on and what questions you will ask. When Anglia decides that a certain story is appropriate for the show it is aired. If the AHS working with another group is part of that story, then that is aired as well. Like when the AHS got a large number of dogs from a property west of Phoenix and one of the dogs went to Southwest German Shepherd Rescue. So, if AzCATs had a show, they may not be able to mention all of the groups they work with, unless it was part of a story.

"Starr, from your comments I can't help but get the feeling that you have a problem with people who speak out in favor of the smaller rescues."

I have no problem with smaller rescues or those who speak out for them. I have a problem with YOU, and the way you advocate for those smaller rescues. You advocate for one group or groups by being negative about another. I have never said anything but positive things about other rescue groups, and that they do good work on limited budgets, mostly with volunteers and that they deserve to be recognized for that. I have also made some factual statements about AzCATs, and some of the things they do and don't do. You, on the other hand, had an entire post about how firefighters are better than the EAMTs. What I am trying to say is if you want to advocate for those smaller groups, you should do it in a more positive manner.

Cat, do you remember this?

"NP. I think on this topic, everyone let their emotions get the better of them whether you are a critic or not. Yes, these people are very special for what they do and as I stated before, I have a great respect for them.

Here in the Phoenix area, the EAMTs are pretty well known even without the show, but you still get a segment of the population that didn't even know the unit let alone the show even existed.

You don't see too many stories about them in the local media here which is a real shame since the work they do is vital but on the same token, the smaller rescues need publicity too. We have a very active animal rescue community in Arizona. The AHS seems to work with quite a lot of them. I think Animal Planet even had an episode of Animal Heroes Phoenix reflecting the AHS' working relationship with the smaller groups." - Catprotector, 12/01/06


In closing, I tried to end the string of this type of posts earlier, but you continue to skew what I post to fit your agenda. Maybe now we can get back to discussing the actual show.

SS&C

P.S. What I want to make very clear is that even I didn't know exactly what the EAMTs deal with on a daily basis until I saw the first show. I was proud of my husband and the EAMTs before, and have become more so since seeing the shows. For that I will not apologize, and none of the EAMTs or the AHS should have to aplolgize for the fact that Animal Planet has a show that focuses on them. You act like they should, and for that you should apologize. Be happy that there is a show exposing the problems in animal welfare here, but be hopeful that there will be more with a different focus.

Is there any winning with you Starr? How is my posting facts and figures at all being negative? I think if anything my posts have been balanced and that includes both the negative and the positive. You may not agree with everything but I would at least hope you'd have respect for another person's position.

I have to wonder how you figure that by pointing out both good and bad it's negative. It seems that if someone points out that they feel the show as a viewer should attempt to cover all the rescues equally you feel it is a negative attack on the AHS as a whole and on the EAMTs. Nobody is attacking the EAMTs. All I am doing is talking from the viewpoint of the viewer.

In regards to the production, the EAMTs and AHS may not have much say in what gets aired but you also have to wonder about the flip side. How is focusing attention on one group and leaving out the other groups fair? Like I said, this isn't AHS' fault and nobody is blaming them. That is the fault of the media. If you want to narrow it down to this show's level it would be the fault of Animal Planet and the production company. If AzCATs had a show and knowing them like I do, they'd make it clear they'd want equality. They have shown this time and time again on The Animal World especially when they had a sponsor who could have told them, they had to talk about so and so. On another level, I can say I have been involved with show production and the one thing I can say is that I always make sure all the animal rescue groups get their shot to talk about the issues.

Like I said, they may have mentioned others in passing but they still keep the focus on one group and one group only. If you are going to have a show called Animal Planet Hereos: Phoenix why not do shows that go from group to group? It would make it very well balanced and show how all of them work and the relationships they also have with other rescues. Can you imagine how many of them would prosper and thus let the public know what they have to offer? That would be great.

Don't make me out to be the bad guy here Starr. I appreciate your passion for the AHS and for the EAMTs. I think we can all agree that what they are doing is a good thing. I also respect your viewpoint. I hope deep down somewhere you respect mine and where I'm coming from.

In my defense of the smaller groups I have listed the positives. If you feel they are doing a wonderful job then how come you yourself aren't agreeing to the fact they deserve to have an equal moment in the spotlight? From your posts it seems you are very reluctant to say that you'd love to have a show like that.

As for the firefighters being better than the EAMTs, I never said they were. I merely pointed out the other heroes in our community that have just as tough a job to do. I'm not sure how relevant it is to this conversation but right now we're talking about a show giving equal time to everyone.

I'm not using your posts against you in order to suit my purpose. I was merely trying to explain another position and clear up some misconceptions. Sure, some of the facts also get mixed in the same post with opinion but that is also what a discussion is all about.

Yes, I do remember that discussion about the EAMTs and how some didn't know about them but in the same respect the other rescues deserve equal coverage. The mainstream media needs to wake up and smell the coffee that by focusing on one animal rescue group and ignorning the others you may also be doing more harm than good. A double edge sword that is always there and a very unwanted side effect.

As for an apology, I wouldn't ask you to apologize for a show based on the EAMTs and AHS. But why ask me to apologize for feeling that the show could be improved to have them focus on the other groups as well? Isn't that what balance is supposed to be about? If you think what the smaller groups is doing is great for the community why not impress upon Animal Planet to take the show to the other rescues? Would you support that idea? I'm guessing by the previous responses you are somewhat reluctant.

I can say this, we can agree to disagree. You and I are on opposite sides of the issue here but I can say that we both agree that it is good that all the groups are out there doing their work. Hopefully, now we can end this thread and move on to a different topic.

As stated before Starr, I hope you have a Happy New Year and it is filled with peace and prosperity. Happy New Year to all the cats, the others on this board and to anyone else I may have missed.

I view all of these AC series as merely showing representative examples of the good work done by all of the fine organizations that help animals in trouble. And they usually picked the "big player" non profits to do this. Fine with me.

This is AP's ball game. If anyone has a suggestion about how they could alter their approach, they should make it to AP. There's no intentional slap here at other organizations that one may be connected to, there's just focus on the ones they selected.

Why ring in discussions of what AP could have done or can do when we have enuf to discuss about what they DID show us?

I personally agree with their approach - this gave us deeper exposure to the functioning of ONE selected organization in each city so that we could more clearly see what the animal welfare trade is up against - more detailed individual stories about both the animals and the personnel dealing with their particular situations. Again, "representative examples". This let us really get on the ground with individual cases.

Pull the cameras back and try to cover more area organizations in the same timeframe, and we would be deprived of the detail we see now.
People need to SEE that detail. Not every viewer knows all that much about this whole topic, and the stories strike home very effectively. They're parables of a sort, these stories, used for millennia by all sorts of folks to get a point across and well-established for their effectiveness within individual cultures and religions.

I also personally think that they came up with this Animal Cops Heroes tag for the AHS series as a marketing ploy because all the series are sagging, except perhaps Animal Precinct, and they were trying to beef up viewership. They may have run this entire concept into the ground ratings-wise, and are analysing what to do next about it as we type here.

We viewers may be standing in deeper water than this concern about other orgs in Phoenix not being represented. We may be losing all the series.

If I had any interest in taking up some issue about the AC series with AP, that's what I'd be focussing on. For example:

1. Stop processing "new" Houston film. The old team, probably the best in all the series outside of the ASPCA one and unique for its countryside horse work, is gone, the new one is pale by comparison and has little appeal.

2. Add cities.

3. Revive Detroit - it has unique AC problems and it was right to include them.

4. Ditch Miami or focus more on their exotics work. That's Miami's unique contribution to all the series. And get Anglia in there - that other production company with its tacky beach scenes and poorly edited stories isn't helping.

5. Ditch San Francisco or change the story lines. Chasing one stray dog thru its beautiful streets gets the stray dog point across just fine. You're not there to film the streets of San Francisco, Anglia.

6. Where are tne new Phoenix episodes?

Etc.

And all of these suggestions are as irrelevant to the immediate topic of a particular story in the Pheonix series as the rest of it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: karenkat05,

Here's the problem with picking the big player non-profit animal rescues over the the smaller ones. The smaller ones get left out of the mix which is the biggest kick in their stomachs, since many of them work twice as hard as the larger more notable ones. I remember watching Animal Cops when it first came out and still wondered why the smaller groups weren't also given equal coverage? I don't think AP ever answered that question when it was first asked.

With the Animal Cops series they seem to pick organizations that have had a high euthanasia rate as well as ones that have a large marketing arm. As a result, the media has come to think that those types of organizations are the only ones that exist. Thus, as a result, the big ones get most if not all the media coverage and the smaller rescues suffer. That isn't very fair at all, and hopefully the media will change this attitude.

Any series that you do, whether it be Animal Heroes or Cops is always at risk of being shelved. This true of any show produced for TV. The problem I see with the AC & AP Heroes series is the repetition. If the same thing is seen on every show then people stop watching. It's that simple. A lot of shows have gotten cancelled because of this.

The most successful series that AP has had is The Crocodile Hunter, which was one of the biggest draws for viewers. Now that Steve Irwin is gone, the show will never be the same. Will people watch The Croc Hunter if they did a new one? Probably, because they'd be curious enough to see if the new host can have the same energy Irwin did and the same impact. Irwin's show was a big money maker for Animal Planet and Discovery not to mention they got a lot of media attention as a result.

I think a correction needs to made here. Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix is not Animal Cops even though it is produced on the same level. This show deals with the animal paramedics which is the only one of its kind in the nation. Slightly different than the Animal Cops series which focuses on the law enforcement end. The EAMTs have to follow the law, and in order to seize an animal on someone's property that clearly has a human attached to them, must ask for the assistance of the police department.

Of course, one episode I recently saw regarding a hoarding case, the man had a gun in the house. According to what the show reported, the EAMTs took the gun and locked it in one their trucks. That's not a good move by them considering they are animal paramedics not law enforcement. To seize a weapon whether or not due to safety reasons is the job of the police not the AHS. In the episode, the police showed up moments later. What if that weapon had been used in the commision of a felony? The EAMTs would've put their prints all over it and possibly destroy the case (if there was one) the police might have been working on in regards to that individual. It's also a good way for an EAMT to get shot themselves. If the police had pulled up as the EAMTs were walking out with weapons, you can better believe the police are going to draw their weapons. After taking the Citizen's Police Academy, you learn that the collection of evidence is pretty important and if you find a weapon, call the police and don't touch it yourself as it may be needed for evidence later especially if it's used in a crime. You also learn that the police don't care who you work for. They see a weapon, the first thing they do is draw theirs and warn the person to put it down or they might get shot. This is to protect both themselves and the citizens that may be around.

This episode I'm sure was shot almost a year ago so maybe that got ironed out and if it was as AP reported, The AHS was probably reminded that they are not a law enforcement agency. It also could've been a mistake on AP's part during production. Nonetheless, if you find a gun don't pick it up but stand near it until the police arrive to secure it.

AC: Detroit was a pretty decent show when it first started out but still the design like the other shows on that level was to leave out the smaller rescues and cover the big ones. A lot of it has to do with money. That is always going to be the biggest factor. I'm not sure they'll revive the Detroit series. It's been on for a couple of years and it's almost the same type of episode, day in and day out. The New York show had a long run but it got pretty stale to watch.

As for the new Phoenix episodes, they showed more of them around August but apparently they are still shooting the new ones. Of course, it could also be the end as well after the next season. The problem with shows like this (as with any show) is keeping the audience interested. Though the EAMTs day is never the same (different cases every day), Animal Planet seems to have this habit of doing the same thing over and over again. And as stated before, they are also covering one single organization in this show when they could be covering a different organization every season. Equal coverage to all means everyone wins. That is the X Factor and certainly could keep the viewer interested. It is called Animal Planet Heroes: Phoenix but it seems more like Animal Planet Hereos: AHS. The AHS has some great programs, but still the other rescues have ones as well.

I think the other factor working against AC's and