Hudman,

I can think of a better way to phrase that.

About 100 posts ago, I recieved a response about the Find button. The poster was either Lordfrogenhall, Adithsubramanian, or MythMod (I'm not sure). Whoever this person was, he/she was very nice. I still somewhat remember the message. It went something like this:


Chowderhead46,

I'm sorry to bother you, but there happens to be another post similar to yours already going on. This is probably why nobody has posted here. In the future, you can use the Find Button on the forum to find a post like yours. In case you already knew this, I'm sorry to annoy you.

-(Whatever his/her screen name was)-


Being the friendly person I am, I immediately thanked this person and never again had this problem. If I were to be that person, I would say the same thing. I believe that this letter is the solution to these problems.

-Chowderhead46-

Mythmod, I apologize, this is the only board that I read on DC and I didn't know they were all run together. I understand why my option would not be pratical. I was just trying to come up with a better solution.

So let's say we develop a paragraph to copy and paste into new posters when they have already been PTD. Several good responses have already been posted and I won't bother to try and do better. If you make one universal statement I think people will get the picture.

I think this is much better then ignoring them, as one poster said, nothing makes me leave a board faster then not getting any feed back on my question/post.

Just to add another degree of diffuculty I think we should come up with a second generic message that we can post when someone says something ignorant. Basically a nice way of saying "stop being mean to the newbs."

Again, just an idea.

mc

I like your thinking, Idealcrap. My thought is that we leave out the part that makes the victim feel looked down upon. I have said something like that many times.

A lot of it comes down to how you say things, not what you are saying. We just need to remember that.

theTroll

chowderhead46, Usually when things are too good to be true... Anyway, I thought this response above was too good to be true;
"Chowderhead46,

I'm sorry to bother you, but there happens to be another post similar to yours already going on. This is probably why nobody has posted here. In the future, you can use the Find Button on the forum to find a post like yours. In case you already knew this, I'm sorry to annoy you.

-(Whatever his/her screen name was)-"
So, I did a search for all your posts. I found 4 different original posts that were ignored, and 5 that were answered, and this one...

quote:

chowderhead46: Can small chunks of dry ice shoved into a bottle of water cause it to explode if the bottle is closed immediately after entering to dry ice?

quote:

Sciencegeek77: Its already been tested. It was proved. So DONT TRY it!

Although I like what you said better, I cannot find proof of it anywhere.

Anyway... I like what you said so well, I'll be copy/pasting it in future repeats that I come across. I am a fairly new member, so sometimes I don't know if it has been posted before or not.

If you are bored, like I was, look up my posts. I don't have that many original posts, but you can have great fun in watching me get slammed in the very beginning. I fought back at first, but then I let it go, and moved to bigger & better things.

Recently, I got in a verbal argument with one member, (not mentioning any names) over octane ratings in gasoline, but in the end, we made up very well. He was telling me one thing, which I took the wrong way, and I was telling him something different, which he took the wrong way. It escalated to name calling, and MythMod probably should have locked it, but I'm glad she didn't, as I now have a new friend. I told him the problems I saw in his posts, and he told me the problems he saw in my posts. The thing is, we didn't even notice we were dissing each other. Like Troll says, It's not what you say, but how you say it.

While not posted to death, this particularly topic comes up fairly often itself, or at least something fairly similar like what to do with the new members or one posters. It's usually a relatively small set of members who participate, so I assume that they, along with a few "read only" people are the only ones who really benefit from the ideas. Although Mythmod almost always seems to check in on these and is certainly in the position to propogate some of the ideas. Those who discuss them sometimes change as well to set the example to others.

Anyway, personally, I'm not so sure that just making the board a nicer place will necessarily "bring back" the team to post as themselves on the board.

[] They may not ever really have the time to post on here.

[] They may be like many people who don't like to post on these kinds of forums anyway. Millions probably watch the show but there's only 800k some odd members here for all the boards and all the years.

[] They may be posting anyway but not as themselves. That way they can get honest reponses rather than replies filled with "I love your work" or "you really messed up the POAT myth".

[] Also, posting as themselves presents the problem of "not representing the views of the Discovery Channel" legal issues and havung to be careful what they say.

While it's certainly nice to be more cordial to one another, part of what the show is about is controversial myths which almost automatically implies conflict. Conflict is often a source of excitement (WWF ) which can lead to more interest in the board. This, in turn, can result in more eyes on the ads, so conflict in and of itself isn't necessarily a bad thing for the forum. Name calling is another matter of course.

I would be surprised if the MB's team did not realize this.

Later!

ps. Had to switch computers so I'm on an edit time limit.

<I knew I would run out of time.>

As far as the "use the find button" comments, I don't see anything wrong with a short but informative:

"This topic has been discussed many times on the forum. Please use the 'Find' button to find out more."

or

"The Mythbusters already did this on the show. It was busted/plausible/confirmed. Please use the 'Find' button if you want to find out more".

That way, the new user gets a response (providing the attention that they may be looking for) and can elaborate if necessary if they feel their idea is different and has not been addressed before. Hopefully, using "please" will help to smooth over any perceived offense.

Let's face it, most of time, a quick Google search can answer most of their questions, though, admittedly, not always. If they're not willing to do that themselves, I see no reason to do too much of the work for them unless you're just interested/involved in the subject, have discussed it often before, or it's obviously from someone who is very young.

One more thing from my previous post (since I ran out of time). When I said this ...

"I would be surprised if the MB's team did not realize this."

... I should also have mentioned that the idea about controversy is not lost on TDC people too. While members' attitudes can be influenced through peer pressure, it's unlikely to change all that many people, especially the new guys. I think Discovery's instructions and guidelines to the moderators (especially here) as to what to allow and/or promote and what to discourage affects the board more profoundly.


Later!

Alright, fine. I made that post up. But still, that's what I want others to say to me. At least, that's what I would say if I found a extra post.

quote:

As far as the "use the find button" comments, I don't see anything wrong with a short but informative:

"This topic has been discussed many times on the forum. Please use the 'Find' button to find out more."

or

"The Mythbusters already did this on the show. It was busted/plausible/confirmed. Please use the 'Find' button if you want to find out more".

That way, the new user gets a response (providing the attention that they may be looking for) and can elaborate if necessary if they feel their idea is different and has not been addressed before. Hopefully, using "please" will help to smooth over any perceived offense.

Sometimes the FIND button results in multiple related topics each with dozens of posts, many of which conflict with each other. One of the first topics I was nterested in water whether hot water pipes frooze before cold water pipes in a freeze. The FIND button resulted in so many related topics it was a major effort to wade through them, and the majority of them had posts stating things like "already busted". However after wading through hundreds of posts someone had posted a link to the MPEMBA (sp?) effect that gave credence to the reported phenomenon. A post that simply stated the topic had already been discussed would have been of little value, however a post that refered to the MPEMBA effect would have be invaluable. So I would suggest members ignore a post that brings up an old subject, or a polite "this has been discussed before and the conclusion was......, use the FIND button and Keywords ...... to see the full discussion. This taks some efffort to do the research on the old topic, but some members don't mind doing it, and if you don't want to be the one to do it, just ignore the post.

Goody2shoes, that's why, when I suggest to someone that they use "find", I ALSO try to suggest some key words for them to use with it.

In your case, if someone had told you to do a "find" for 'MPEMBA', you would have quickly found what you needed without wading through all that chaff. You would have learned a bit about using the find function, without having someone else do the work for you.

I don't defend careless non-find posting or outright trolls (nothing personal, thetroll ), but we should try to be as rational in our methods of persuasion as we strive to be in our science. It's very easy to lose patience and lapse into 'curmudgeonly nitpickery' with the sarcasm and the flavin, but we're our own worst enemy when we do.

O.K.

I haven't said anything about this yet, Ithappened this morning.

The whole use the find button deal, yeas I am guilty!

Well this morning a post from October of last year was resurected, by believe it or not a first time poster. Guess what the replies he got were!

Well they went a little like this.

You should have let this post die it is lame(granted it was a very over posted myth) but he used the find button and still gets flamed for it.

A newby using the find button is so rare, yet it finally happens and this is the welcome they receive here. WOW!

quote:

Originally posted by bambutu:
Hey! Welcome to the forums! I hope your time here is enjoyable. Want a bit of friendly advice? ALWAYS use find first if you plan to post any myths. There is a good chance that what you want to post has already been posted or has been tested on the show. Using find will save you any possible flaming

So now lets jump all over a new member about using FIND before they even post anything.

What a joke.

quote:

Originally posted by GTCGreg:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by bambutu:
Hey! Welcome to the forums! I hope your time here is enjoyable. Want a bit of friendly advice? ALWAYS use find first if you plan to post any myths. There is a good chance that what you want to post has already been posted or has been tested on the show. Using find will save you any possible flaming

That wasn't my intent it that post. I was only offering a bit of advice to prevent any possible flames.

It seems you missed that....

Just doesn't seem like a very friendly greeting to me. And if I took it the wrong way, I'm sure a new member could also. Not long ago, theTroll let me know that something I said to a new member was a little rude. I jumped all over him for it, but then after I went back and read what I had said, I saw that he was right. It hadn't been my intention when I wrote it but after reviewing it, I could see how it could be taken the wrong way.

quote:

Originally posted by GTCGreg:
Just doesn't seem like a very friendly greeting to me. And if I took it the wrong way, I'm sure a new member could also.

I guess the "" at the end of my post wasn't obvious enough for you then.....sorry you misunderstood my intent....

Hmmm... Maybe a mandatory yet simple tutorial upon signing up a new membership could help reduce some of the board problems. Just a suggestion.

A 'find' tutorial is the way to go. While the 'Read before posting' stickies are a good effort, you have to remember that most newcomers come here for one reason: to post myths. They aren't going to check if four thousand other people have already posted the same thing, because they think they have a unique and original idea. Who else would have though to put a focusing lens on the Archimedes death ray? Surely no one else, right? Well, let me go suggest that and see what happens.

But one thing to keep in mind is that some of the myths here are just so...stupid and poorly conceived (forgive me, but I can't think of any other way to say it). Look at the weapons forum and tell me what you see there. Let me give you a rundown:

"Can the fifty cal tear a guy in half without even touching them?"

"Can you really set a bullet off by dropping it?"

"Can you really blow up a tank with a handgun?"

etc, etc, etc.

Ordinarily it wouldn't be too bad, but there is a thread with a list of PTD myths and a thread dedicated to misconceptions and falsehoods about the .50. To add insult to injury, there are often three or four identical threads on the same page as the newly posted one; half of the time, back to back. It just seems like some people are posting just for the sake of posting and aren't even taking the time or effort to create/find actual myths or ask valid questions.

"Can you die if you are killed?"...that's the caliber of questions I see around here which is why the whole issue of using 'find' does merit some attention in my opinion. There is nothing rude or inappropriate about asking someone to think before they post.

Pardon the double post, but I'm just too slow.

here is my suggestion:

1. Definitely a 'Find' tutorial

2. Set up something where people have to post in other threads before making their own. One one forum I used to visit, you had to post three times in other threads before you could make your own topics. Perhaps the Admins could set it up where you have to post in a thread that outlines rules and guidelines for posts (what's appropriate, what is considered a potential myth, what is a reasonable question versus what could be Googled in half the time it took to post it here, etc). They have to post there, stating that they understand the rules to get 'green lighted' to create their own threads. I don't know how it would be done or implemented, but if I was in charge, that's how I would have things set up. Of course, that is probably why I am not. XD

I agree with thetroll. I, however, have realized that just trying to tell people to use the FIND button is not going to do it. Since we get new fly-by posters everyday, they're not going to see the amount of times that we try to encourage the use of the FIND button. They are not going to understand how seriously we take it. I think, even if the change is in the distant future, it may take a change in technology. I know this would be hard to do with eve community, but eventually, they're may be a way.