Why does everyone have a problem with getting a dog from a breeder? What I mean is that every time someone posts something about "where should I get my dog?" or "what kind of dog should I get?" everyone blasts them with ADOPT!!! ADOPT!!! ADOPT!!! There's nothing wrong with shelter dogs, don't get me wrong, but c'mon! Not EVERYONE wants a mixed breed, some people prefer purebreds.
People tell others to adopt because there are too many dogs in the shelters. Most people who come here asking for advice on breeds aren't planning to show their dogs or anything like that. They just want a pet. So why do they need to go to a breeder? Sure, some like the health guarantees, but IMO the risk is worth it to save a life from the shelter. Not to mention 30-40% of the dogs in shelters are purebreds. I got my purebred pointer from the shelter. Noone really has a problem about others getting dogs from breeders. It's who the breeder is that matters. Searching for a breeder is hard work and can take years to find a good one and get to the top of their waiting list. So why not just adopt a dog if you don't have plans on showing or don't mind taking a lifesaving chance?
I totally disagree with naztuki! I have a purebred and he is the best thing that has ever happened to me. He has never once gotten sick with something that mixed breeds don't have and he cost only a little bit more than a mix. The thing is, is that some breeders don't know when to stop so they don't. If we always adopt, what are going to happen to the poor purebreds that nobody will buy because people are posting on boards like these to adopt and not to go to a breeder. I mean, come on! Think about it! If you just tell everyone to adopt, the Pounds are just gonna get crowded with purbreds that nobody will buy from the breeders! Nothing is wrong with purbreds!
I think overall theres no harm in wanting a purebred, i think though that if your looking to invest in 2 or more dogs as family companions then at least make one a shelter baby. Like i've stated earlier in posts i've got one true purebred the rest are all mixes and 2 of them are pound puppies. So we've got a little bit of everything. That's what i would recommend. Go with a purebred as an indoor companion or bedtime pal, and a shelter dog as you all around outdoor exercise dog. The little ones are certinally easier to take "bye-byes" and the bigger shelter dogs make excellent walking dogs. IMO
I was just reminded, about a year or 2 ago i was looking in the shelter in my hometown for a dog for my mother, and there sure as fire there was a pomerainen puppy there, when i inquired about the dog the shelter worker told me that her owner had just dumped her at the shelters door, this dog was a purebred pom. Another time i'd gone to help my friend locate her dog and another womans AKC/CKC German Shepard was there (her stud dog)her neighbors son had let the dog out of the fence. Needless to say one rare occasions some shelters do end up with purebreds. FYI, the pom had someone who had already paid to adopt her. Nonetheless, not all pound puppies are mixes, every once in a while there may be a gem of a purebred there. So keep looking and checking.
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Thank you, futurevet7994- at least someone agrees with me! I just prefer purebreds. And for the most part, only "popular" breeds (Such as German shepherds & goldens) have health problems; such as hip displasiya becuase they're popular and there are too many irresponsible breeders out there that just keep pumping out the puppies, only wanting the $$$$!!! Natzuki--What you posted is not even true. If you guys love mixed breeds so much, did you ever come to realize that your dogs were formed by purebreds? Didn't think so...
I was with you. If you prefer purebreds then thats what you should go with, all i said was keep an open mind that occasionally shelters will have them too. As for where my dogs all came from i know somewhere in thier lines theres a purebred dog, but for the most part they are mixes.
BTW, i've always loved papillons, just the name is awesome the butterfly ears or butterfly something. That and they just look so adorable. My top purebred little dogs are Chihuahuas, Dachshounds, Pomerainens, Papillons, and toy poodles.
Genetics are genetics- you have two dogs that have a genetic disorder like hip dyplasia etc, you are more likely to get it. Since breeders screen for these disorders ( good ones that is) its less likely to occur..
People who want a pure bred dog, but don't want to show, should consider getting a pure bred from a breed rescue. The papillon rescue group has plenty of lovely paps needing homes. I've seen several pure bred Paps on petfinder.
Remember, our country's economy runs on supply and demand. If pet homes want purebreds, then someone will meet that supply. Breeders breed to meet that supply. If the demand were less, there would be less unwanted dogs in America.
Would pure bred dogs disappear altogether as you suggest. No. Of course not. What would happen is that breeders who are ethical and responsible and who want to further the breed would breed dogs for show. But, back yard breeders and puppy mills would discontinue breeding because there would be no money in it.
Remember also, when you purchase a dog from a breeder, you are, indeed, not adopting a rescue dog (pure bred or otherwise) in a shelter. Those dogs are put to sleep. People hate it when I point this out. They don't want to think of themselves as the problem, but the solution. When you purchase from a breeder, you ARE taking a home away from a dog - even a pure bred Pap. It's important that you face that fact.
I have pure bred shelties that I got from a breeder. I will do so again. But, I WON'T do so with my eyes shut. When I choose to do that, I WILL know that I am not providing a home for a shelter dog. None the less, I will do so because I show my dogs. I show my dogs in agility, and I want to know the genetic lines my dogs come from AND I want to know nothing has yet been written on my dog's clean slate. Then, I have the power to turn my dog into what I need for competition.
But, I don't do so blindly. If you choose to go to a breeder, fine. Just know what the consequences are. Understand your reasoning for not going to get a rescued pure bred.
If I weren't showing, I would have all rescued dogs.
(BTW, I have rescued two dogs,a cat, a hamster and a guinea pig in the past. Mixed breeds make just as wonderful pets as purebreds.)
I personally don't find anything "wrong" with purebreeds.
I just find people's reasoning for breeding and buying purebreds to be wrong.
If you're looking for a family pet or companion (which is exactly why most people get dogs), there's no reason why a purebred is better then a rescue/shelter dog.
Not to mention that many people that breed purebreds aren't doing it for the betterment of the breed, they're doing it to make profit. They don't have excellent specimins of the breed, their dogs aren't health checked and proven at show. Most purebred puppies come from a few people that get together and breed their two same breed dogs together.
Buying from a responsible breeder takes a lot of research and work, and your going to have to pay some extra money for that well breed dog.
Many people would rather get a $250 papered labrador, then a champion labrodor with field proven parents that cost $750 a piece. Especially when it's going to be a "family" pet. They justify it by saying, "we dont' need a champion labrodor, we just want a family pet". Which goes back to my orginal statement of a shelter dog making just as fine a pet as a purebred.
Not to mention many people by purebreds without understanding the dogs purpose. Labradors are retrieving, water dogs. They are a working breed that have a lot of energy, can grow to be quite large, and shed. Some labs make great famly dogs, others need constant work and attention otherwise they turn into anxious, hyper and annoying dogs.
Originally posted by ilovemypapillons: Thank you, futurevet7994- at least someone agrees with me! I just prefer purebreds. And for the most part, only "popular" breeds (Such as German shepherds & goldens) have health problems; such as hip displasiya becuase they're popular and there are too many irresponsible breeders out there that just keep pumping out the puppies, only wanting the $$$$!!! Natzuki--What you posted is not even true. If you guys love mixed breeds so much, did you ever come to realize that your dogs were formed by purebreds? Didn't think so...
No, almost all purebred dogs have health problems. Its just how bad or how many a certain breed has. Some dogs are not that popular and still have health problems. And you usually get health problems from inbreeding, to HELP the breed, not just breed for profit. But I do prefer the purebred dog. I say if you dont care, go ahead and get a mutt. I want to get a purebred and a mutt when I'm older. But then again, there are many purebreds already in shelters who need homes. So maybe you can kill two birds with one stone and adopt a purebred dog.
Originally posted by ilovemypapillons: If you guys love mixed breeds so much, did you ever come to realize that your dogs were formed by purebreds? Didn't think so...
You could actually turn that around. All purebreds were formed by mutts. In the beginning, there were no breeds, just mutts. So your purebreds are descendents of mutts.
I honestly don't see why people feel that purebreds are better than mutts. They're all dogs. It's racism IMO.
The fact of the matter is- is that there are too many dogs in shelters. Purebred or mixed. We have a huge pet overpopulation crisis, so there is no need to add more dogs that aren't going to help their breed. If more people thought of going to the shelter to get their pets, then we wouldn't have this problem. Most people aren't planning on screening a breeder. They just want to find a cute puppy. I've seen plenty of cute puppies at the shelter. I've learned that many of those cute puppies had to be euthanized simply because people just want to get that cute purebred puppy from the pet store or the breeder in the paper, even though they had no plans on showing it. Whereas- they could save themselves some money, and get a dog that's on death row at their local shelter.
The argument that well bred purebred dogs have more genetic health problems than mutts is unfounded and completly unprovable!
The truth of the matter is that ethicalbreeders make up the overwhelming majority of contributors to canine health studies. The parent clubs are also open and honest about the problems within the breed that are confirmed through these studies. So naturally those are the ones the puppy buying public is most aware of.
How many studies have we seen on inherited health problems in mutts? None! And we aren't likely to ever see one.
All anyone who wants to know the truth has to do is read some of the hundreds of pet forums available. They'll quickly see for themselves in the discussions on health that mixed breeds are just as likely to be diagnosed with the exact same problems as purebreds.
Anyone who choses to have a purebred dog has the absolute right to own one; and anyone who breeds purebred dogs has the same right breed them.
However times are much different now than they were years ago. Everyone without exception, who buys or breeds a purebred dog must consider the role they're playing in the fate of the 9 million abandoned dogs being put to death in shelters every year.
Every puppy, purebred or not, added to the overwhelming dog population fills a spot a homeless dog might have had!
The choice of whether or not to buy a purebed is our own, and the opinions of others are just their opinions.
However, if by voicing their opinions on discussion boards they can save even one life; that's always a good thing!
All the dogs I have had so far either would have wound up at the pound, or had a far worse life than the one I have provided for them. They have all been mixed breeds.
My first dog was a GSD/pointer/retriever mix,named Sugarbear, and she was a very special soul. She touched not only our life, but those of our family members she later lived with.
Next came Merlin, an american eskimo/lhasa-apso mix. Neither of his two parent breeds would bring to mind the image of a water dog, but he is. That dog loves to swim. He's back with my in-laws again, trained, after spending several years with me, and is being a great lap dog.
Then there's Merry, a chihuahua/shih-tzu mix born on christmas day. She's so ugly she's cute, with her troll doll hair. She loves children, and anyone else who wants to pet her, an ambassador for her species.
And the newest is Jade, a labrador/catahoula mix. A super hyper combination? She is my running buddy, but also just as happy to curl up on the couch and chill.
The fact is, I would never want any of the above breeds of dog. Not purebred ones. In my experience, mixes are so much more than their parent breeds. There's so many possibilities of unusual and hidden talents. Perhaps it's my training that has caused all these wonderful dogs in my life, but all I know is that personally, I'm hooked on mixes. I'm always looking forward to what combination it will be next.
Originally posted by naztuki: We are right about this. Purebred dogs have more health issues than mutts. Mutts having been bred from many other breeds have acumulated traits from other breeds and have a stronger health system. It has been proven. I know some purebred dogs who have more problems than mutts.
No Natzuki, it has not been proven.
Mixbreeds being healthier then purebreads is just another myth with nothing to back it up. It's impossible to keep accurate records or do comprehensive research on genetic health problems in mixed breeds.
Medical health records do show constant and reoccuring problems in many purebred dogs.
That's because breed clubs and their members are constantly monitoring the health of the breed. There is no club to monitor the health of mixed breeds.
Many of these "new" genetic problems have been around for ages in all dogs; purebred and mixed breed alike. There just weren't any tests available to detect them.
Some mixed breed dogs are crosses of purebreds that share similar health problems. This means the same defective gene could come over from both parents and pair up in their puppies. For example, a "Cockapoo" puppy has one Cocker Spaniel parent and one Poodle parent. Both of these breeds are prone to a long list of similar defects that could easily pair up.
Some mixed breed dogs are inbred just as much or worse than purebred dogs. For example, some people who breed "Cockapoos" have only a few dogs whom they keep interbreeding. Whether purebred or mixed, it is much easier for defective genes to pair up when the gene pool is small and the dogs are related.
Don't be duped into thinking that mixing breeds will result in healthier offspring. The truth is that puppies, whether purebred or mixed, inherit genes from each parent. If the parents pass along the genes for a hereditary disease, the pups stand a good chance of having that disease. Hybrid vigor, the idea that unrelated parents produce healthier offspring works only if natural selection is in operation. In the wild, a dog with clinical symptoms of a debilitating disease such as hip dysplasia or epilepsy would not be able to survive, and so would not pass on its genes. But in the modern world, with reasonable veterinary care and a constant food source, dogs with serious, even deadly, problems do survive long enough to produce lots of pups.
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Originally posted by naztuki: And people also adopt from shelters because the dogs cost a lot less there. My mom got our last dog (a mutt) from a shelter for $30. And he's still here today.
There's not many shelters where you can adopt a dog for only $30. Usually when you get a dog from a shelter it's been fixed, given all vactinations, wormed, microchipped, tested for lymes and heartworms, groomed, fed, etc.
All that costs a lot more then $30. Even though shelters are not for profit, they also aren't trying to lose money either. The average pet at a shelter goes for about $150-$300. That's still a lot cheaper then a purebred puppy in most cases, but you're also getting a more healthy dog in most respects.
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Originally posted by naztuki: The purebreeds have the problem because they are bred within each other, no mixed with other breeds getting the characteristics of the new breed. It's just a fact. I always think of the effect something will have on something else, unlike many people who act before they think. Change one tihng, and you change the whole string of things. Sure, if people adopted more mutts there would be more purebreds, but then humans would realize this and the economy of dogs would be adjusted to fit. This is exactly why there is a such thing as spaying or neutering your pets.
Your thinking is simple and idealistic, but simpley not true, there is no evidence to support this arguement. I used to think this was true too... actually, not too long ago, and I found out I was wrong.
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Originally posted by naztuki: I also believe mutts live longer than purebreds. I'm not sure if it's a fact or not, but I think someone said that somewhere.
Again, not so true. Just because you "heard someone say it somewhere" doesn't mean it's true. You should evaluate your sources more carefully before trying to take on standing on your own soap box.
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My papillons are expected to live about 16 years, so I don't know where you got the idea that purebreds don't live long. [???] I adopted all 3 of my cats. The only one that was purebred was an adopted Bombay. My philosophy is that if you truly love an animal, you will take it in and love it, no matter where its backround was.
Originally posted by texgurl: All the dogs I have had so far either would have wound up at the pound, or had a far worse life than the one I have provided for them. They have all been mixed breeds.
My first dog was a GSD/pointer/retriever mix,named Sugarbear, and she was a very special soul. She touched not only our life, but those of our family members she later lived with.
Next came Merlin, an american eskimo/lhasa-apso mix. Neither of his two parent breeds would bring to mind the image of a water dog, but he is. That dog loves to swim. He's back with my in-laws again, trained, after spending several years with me, and is being a great lap dog.
Then there's Merry, a chihuahua/shih-tzu mix born on christmas day. She's so ugly she's cute, with her troll doll hair. She loves children, and anyone else who wants to pet her, an ambassador for her species.
And the newest is Jade, a labrador/catahoula mix. A super hyper combination? She is my running buddy, but also just as happy to curl up on the couch and chill.
The fact is, I would never want any of the above breeds of dog. Not purebred ones. In my experience, mixes are so much more than their parent breeds. There's so many possibilities of unusual and hidden talents. Perhaps it's my training that has caused all these wonderful dogs in my life, but all I know is that personally, I'm hooked on mixes. I'm always looking forward to what combination it will be next.
You can't say that mixes are better. First, because you just said you have never had a purebred. So you can't say that mixes are better, when you have never had that much experience with purebreds. Second, all dogs are equally as good, and nobody should have a problem with getting a mutt or a purebred.
Originally posted by naztuki: You know, sometimes if you ask a scientist or a resource that know more than those things than you do, it's most likely truse because they've sutdied it. My parents have gone around a long time dealing with animals, and have picked up these facts from people who know things. Experts, breeders, trainers, people who teach lessons. These people can teach others how to deal with things like these.
There is over 500,000 members on this site, it's very possible that one of them could be a scientist, a parent, an expert, or trainer. Not everone is a adolecent trying to toot their horn.
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Originally posted by naztuki: Why do you reply to me saying I'M wrong about the purebreeds coming from mix breeds when I never ORIGINALLY said it?
You were the first person to say it on this thread, so I was responding to you.
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Originally posted by naztuki: Do you have something against me?!?! Someone else said it and YOU never said anything to them, but when I repeat it, I'M the one whoes wrong!
Someone else did correct me, so instead of turning into a screaming little monkey, I went out and researched it, and found it to be true. It was really easy. Someone corrects you, because they want to help you learn, not "go after you". Crazy concept.. I know.
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Originally posted by naztuki: But what do you define as purebreeds? Dogs who decended from the wild dogs many years ago?
There's much debate over where, when and how dogs were domesticated. We don't know much about it, so you saying dogs decended from wild dogs many years ago is not proven. And when you say many years... try tens of thousands of years. It's not like it happened back in the 80's.
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Originally posted by naztuki: There were mutts back then too, so not all our purebreeds are from purebreeds. Nothing is Pure; prefect. Even most of us humans are so called "mutts". What, maybe your mother is Chinese and your father French? We are animals too, for those who don't believe it.
No one is debating you on the fact that mutts exist. Yes, there are many things that are pure and perfect. There is such a thing as pure raw sugar, such a thing as a perfect snowflake. Humans don't reproduce to make a pure breed. That analogy is ridiculous. Humans having children is because relationships form, and people choose to have families. You sound like Hilter when you say things like that. And no Natucki, humans ARE NOT animals. We are classified as mammels yes, but that's where are link with other creatures ends. Once again, let me politely remind you to get off that box you found.
